HC Deb 22 May 1984 vol 60 cc811-3
3. Mr. Chapman

asked the Secretary of State for Defence what is his latest estimate of the number of Union of Soviet Socialist Republics' SS4, SS5 and SS20 missiles targeted on western Europe.

The Secretary of State for Defence (Mr. Michael Heseltine)

As the recently published "Statement on the Defence Estimates" describes, there are now 243 SS20s and 224 SS4s targeted on western Europe. The SS5s have now been withdrawn. Each SS20 missile has three warheads.

Mr. Chapman

Will my right hon. Friend confirm, to get this whole issue into perspective, that NATO will withdraw five times as many nuclear weapons as will be deployed in the ground-launched cruise missile and Pershing II programmes, and that there has been no equivalent response from the USSR, which in the last five and a half years has tripled the number of SS missiles that it has targeted on western Europe?

Mr. Heseltine

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for making that point, because there has been a significant and relentless increase in the number of SS20s deployed, facing both east and west. I can confirm that the NATO Alliance has, since 1980, taken decisions to remove nearly 2,500 nuclear warheads from Europe, bringing the total at the end of that removal period to the lowest for 20 years.

Mr. Strang

Does the Secretary of State recognise that the production and deployment of additional nuclear weapons, both by the Soviet Union and the United States, should be deplored? Will he comment on the strategy behind the decision of the US Government to manufacture 4,000 air-launched and 4,000 sea-launched cruise missiles in addition to those cruise missiles which are to be deployed on land?

Mr. Heseltine

The hon. Gentleman will recognise that the US is seeking every avenue to discuss these matters with the Soviet Union. The USSR, having nearly completed its deployment of these intermediate range weapons, walked out of the negotiating forum which could have led to discussions to achieve very much the end which the hon. Gentleman has in mind. I do not see how I can be expected to blame both sides equally.

Sir Antony Buck

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the figures which he has given justify to the full the deployment in this country of cruise missiles and, similarly, give full justification for our proceeding with the Trident programme?

Mr. Heseltine

I am grateful to my hon. and learned Friend for his comments. As everyone knows, we did everything that we reasonably could to avoid the deployment of cruise missiles in this country. We spent four years, having warned the Soviet Union, seeking meaningful negotiations which would have enabled it to withdraw its weapons systems and avoid any equivalent systems on our side.

Mr. Cartwright

In view of the continued SS20 deployment and the forward deployment of the SS21, what steps do the Government believe should be taken to get the Soviet Union to return to the Geneva negotiating table?

Mr. Heseltine

I believe that the hon. Gentleman has followed with the same despair as the Government feel the attempts by a range of statesmen internationally to persuade the Soviet Union to indulge in meaningful negotiations. Every endeavour to persuade the Soviet Union to talk is being made, but those endeavours are being made entirely on a one-way basis and one can detect no reciprocal approach.

Sir Patrick Wall

Is it not true that what matters is not the Soviet overture but the fact that now, for the first time, Europe has a chance of shooting back if it ever becomes necessary, and therefore avoiding world war 3?

Mr. Heseltine

I know that my hon. Friend shares the Government's view that the essence of our deployment is deterrence. We believe that as long as we have a capability that ensures that the Soviets are certain that they could never win from an attack, they will never make such an attack. They have nothing to fear from the West. There is no way in which our alliance is an aggressive one.

Mr. Denzil Davies

As it is part of the Government's case, as I understand it, that cruise missiles have had to be deployed in Britain because of or in retaliation against the SS20s, and as, apparently, the Soviet Union is now deploying other missiles in retaliation against our cruise missiles, will the Secretary of State confirm that NATO or the Government have no intention of deploying even more missiles of any kind in retaliation against the Soviet missiles?

Mr. Heseltine

There are no NATO plans of which the House is not aware for the deployment of further weapons systems, but it is important to point out that the Soviet announcement that it is to replace some of its forward deployed nuclear weapons systems and intends to carry that through clearly shows that the Soviet Union already possesses the weapons to do so. I believe that the Soviet Union would have proceeded to do that regardless of what we did.