HC Deb 14 December 1937 vol 330 cc1106-19

10.20 p.m.

Mr. Keeling

I beg to move, in page 17, line 7, after "them," to insert "or."

After this Amendment I am proposing to move an Amendment, in page 17, line 7, to leave out "or otherwise." Under the Clause as it stands, the only persons entitled after the vesting date to search and bore for coal will be, first, the Coal Commission and, secondly, persons authorised by the Coal Commission. The result of accepting these two Amendments would be to extend that permission to existing leaseholders authorised by their leases to search and bore. I think it is necessary that a leaseholder who may, for instance, have several beds of coal one under the other should have the right to bore to beds below so as to prove them before he sinks a shaft. I hope that my hon. and gallant Friend will accept these Amendments.

Captain Crookshank

We leave the existing leases as retained interests, and the Commission have no right to interfere with them. It is quite possible that a clause in an existing lease does give a limited right of this kind to bore, and, that being so, it seems only reasonable that we should make it clear by inserting these Amendments.

Amendment agreed to.

Further Amendment made: In page 17, line 7, leave out "or otherwise."—[Mr. Keeling.]

10.22 p.m.

Sir S. Cripps

I beg to move, in page 17, line 8, at the end, to add: (2) Where any facility, right, or privilege is required to enable the Commission to search or bore for coal in order that searching or boring may be effectively carried out the Commission shall have power to exercise such facility, right, or privilege subject to the payment of compensation to the person upon or through whose land the said operation, or either of them, is carried out. (3) In particular, but without prejudice to the generality of the foregoing provision, such rights shall include—

  1. (a) a right to let down the surface;
  2. (b) a right of air-way, shaft-way, or surface or underground wayleave, or other right for the purpose of access to or conveyance of minerals or the ventilation or drainage of the borings;
  3. (c) a right to use and occupy the surface for the erection of railways, tramways, roads, buildings, or other works, or of dwellings for persons employed in connection with the borings;
  4. (d) a right to obtain a supply of water or other substances in connection with the borings;
  5. (e) a right to dispose of water or other liquid matter obtained from the borings.
(4) Compensation for the exercise of any such facility, right, or privilege shall be assessed in accordance with the provisions of the Acquisition of Land (Assessment of Compensation) Act, 1919. The object of this Amendment is to give the Commission the necessary powers in connection with searching and boring for coal. As far as I can ascertain from the Bill as it stands, although they have the right to search and bore for coal, they have not the necessary powers which will enable them to carry out that process. In the Petroleum Act, where a similar situation arose in connection with prospecting for oil, certain ancillary rights had to be given to those people who were entitled to bore for oil, and these proposed new Sub-sections are framed upon the lines of the powers given in that Act. The class of right which will be required by the Commission if they are to carry out what will be, I presume, a national duty, as well as their desire, is, first, that they should be able to enter upon any land where they imagine coal to be in order that they may carry out operations there, and, secondly, they will have to have the right of making boreholes or short shafts or a number of other works for the purpose of proving the coal for which they are searching. They will also require water supply, the rights of drainage, and the rights of working tramways and railways on the surface in order to carry away the material which they bring up and to bring to the site the materials which they require for boring.

It seems to be essential that somewhere in the Bill these powers should be granted to the Commission, but we cannot find that they are in any part of the Bill. I am sure the hon. and gallant Gentleman will agree that it is no good giving the Commission powers to search and bore unless in fact they can carry out those operations in practice. All that we desire by adding these words is to afford practical means by which the Commission can give effect to their desires. The new Sub-section (4) says that the compensation for the exercise of any such ancillary rights or privileges shall be assessed in accordance with the provisions of the Acquisition of Land (Assessment of Compensation) Act, 1919. That seems to be the convenient way of doing it. It will mean taking an easement over the surface of the land or a right of entry on the land, and they are matters which can easily be dealt with by the proper tribunal under that Act. We hope the hon. and gallant Member will agree that these are reasonable powers which must be held by the Commission.

10.25 p.m.

Captain Crookshank

Some provision must, of course, be made for rights, both underground and on the surface. Underground rights are already granted by the passage of Clause 14, and surface rights are to be found in Clause 18, Subsection (6), where the grant of these rights can be secured under the existing law, which is the Mines (Working Facilities and Support) Act. There, the Commission gets all the necessary rights it requires, and in a more appropriate manner than by the compulsory acquisition suggested by the hon. and learned Member. As the jurisdiction is already there for this purpose, we propose to leave it there. There has never been any difficulty about it in the past, and there is no reason to suppose that there will be any difficulty in the future

10.26 p.m.

Sir S. Cripps

Surely the hon. and gallant Gentleman is not assuming that the Coal Commission will carry on its work in a piecemeal and unorganised manner. It will surely try to settle, by some period of time, its investigation of what the mineral resources are. It may have to start very expensive boring operations; has it to get permission each time it wants to do so in order to prove a case of which I should have thought it was the judge? It seems most ridiculous to make it have to embark upon litigation, they being the people responsible for searching and boring for coal, on every occasion when it wants to make a test of any sort and to make a geological examination anywhere in the country. You are to have all the other parties appear, and cases fought out. It is going to be a most ridiculous procedure.

The old procedure was based upon the idea that you had one individual trying to get what might be regarded as an advantage over another individual, and the courts had to decide between them whether it was in the interests of the nation, or whatever the case was, that one individual should have an advantage as against the other. You are setting up a Coal Commission which is representing the nation and is to be responsible for the mineral resources of the nation. It has to test and ascertain whether they ought to be worked, and it must have the right, under the terms of the Bill, which is given to a licensee of the Board of Trade. The ordinary individual has not to go to the court in order to get facilities to start boring. He can get his right as a licensee without having to go to any court. Surely you are going to put the Coal Commission at least in the same position as a licensee who wants to bore for petroleum for his own gain and not for the national interest. I am sure that the hon. and gallant Gentleman will see the necessity, when you have set up a responsible public body, for giving it power to carry out its duties, and are not putting it under the necessity of starting litigation, very often expensive litigation for all parties, on every occasion when it wants to test in some area or another to find out whether there is coal.

I hope that the hon. and gallant Gentleman will not tie this chain of impossibility around the neck of the Commission at the very outset of the work which he wants it to do. We do not want to have a Commission, whether people agree with its constitution or not, and which the hon. and gallant Gentleman told us on Second Reading is to be able to carry out a large measure of reorganisation in the coal industry, started on its way by putting around its neck the necessity for going to the court every time that it wants to do anything as regards carrying out the job which it has been given. It is a responsible commission, the right hon. Gentleman is here to answer for it in the House if it does anything wrong as regards searching and boring for coal, while as regards general policy he can be attacked in the House of Commons. He can give directions under Clause 2 as to how this duty shall be carried out by the Commission. There is perfectly good Parliamentary control, I am glad to say, over the actions of the Commission, and surely it is better that we should retain that control rather than put it in the hands of some court for the purpose of exercising these functions, which are national functions. It is not a question now between one individual and another; it is a question between a national commission and the public generally; and I suggest that, with the Parliamentary control that exists over the matter, it is desirable that there should be some much wider power than the very limited power given by Clause 18 (6).

Captain Crookshank

The hon. and learned Gentleman has referred to the Petroleum Act. Under that Act licensees get their rights either by agreement or by reference to arbitration, which is exactly the same process that is laid down here.

10.33 p.m.

Mr. E. Evans

Great responsibility and powers are being placed in the hands of this Commission, and they really ought to be enabled to carry out their duties. So far as I can see, no power would be conferred by the Amendment that the Coal Commission will not require in order to carry out their duties effectively. It is true that they can apply to the Railway and Canal Commission, but surely, when these powers are being given to the Coal Commission, they must be enabled to carry them out. It seems to me to be a very reasonable proposal.

10.34 p.m.

Mr. T. Williams

Surely the hon. and gallant Gentleman will tell the Committee exactly what is involved in Clause 18 (6). If, as my hon. and learned Friend suggests, the Commission, every time they want to bore in any area in any part of the country, have to go to the Railway and Canal Commission to obtain permission to bore, that will not only be a very costly proceeding, but a very difficult one, and I do not think that that obligation ought to fall on a commission which is now in possession of all the coal and merely wants to ascertain where the coal is. I should like to give a simple illustration of what may happen, in order to see whether the hon. and gallant Gentleman agrees with it.

The Commission may want to enter upon a certain estate to bore for coal, but the landowner may not want that particular estate disturbed. Now that he is no longer interested in coal royalties, he may prefer that coal should not be mined under any part of his estate. But for the efficient working of the coal mines, knowing the geological formation generally, and anticipating that the working of coal from that point to some other point would be most economical, the Commission may think it advisable to bore in that area, and some landowner, apparently, can prevent them from boring for coal in that neighbourhood unless they proceed to the Railway and Canal Commission, at considerable cost, in order to obtain power to bore. I may be wrong in my assumption that that would be the procedure, but, if that be the procedure, and if the hon. and gallant Gentleman insists on imposing that obligation on the Commission, I hope that every Member sitting on these and many sitting on other benches will oppose him. If I am wrong, the hon. and gallant Gentleman ought to tell us so, and then we shall know exactly why he wants to refrain from giving the Commission power to carry out a duty which the Act will impose upon them. The Commission will naturally want to ascertain as quickly and with as little cost as possible just where the coal is, but the hon. and gallant Gentleman tells us that they must make an application to the Railway and Canal Commission every time they want to bore. If so, will he tell us exactly why he wants them to pass through that procedure, in view of the cost and the difficulties?

10.35 p.m.

Mr. H. G. Williams

This seems to be the first example of the efforts of the hon. and learned Gentleman to rule us by dictation. [Interruption.] Hon. Members must not get cross. This place exists in order that we may learn to tolerate opinions we do not agree with, and if you want to get an early decision on this, perhaps the less I am interrupted the earlier you will get it. The proposal that, without any check or challenge, a body set up by Statute, which happens to own something, but not everything, under the surface, shall have an unqualified right to enter upon anybody's premises, whether that person is willing or unwilling, merely on the ground that subsequent compensation may be paid, is the greatest invasion of the rights of individuals, great and small, that has ever been made. If the hon. and learned Gentleman had any faith that the Commission, if they wanted to do this, would do it under reasonable circumstances, he would not desire that they should do it before they had had their claim to do it examined by some judicial body if the owner objected.

One of the things we have learned, for example, from slum clearance is the objection that people have to being turned out from their houses, even if they are poor. The hon. and learned Gentleman proposes a right to destroy every conceivable kind of amenity. Only last Wednesday this House was discussing the destruction of amenities, and it unanimously resolved that it was a bad thing, and that there should be some protection for amenities. The hon. and learned Gentleman is prepared to give this Commission the right, without challenge, to destroy everything. The hon. Member for Don Valley (Mr. T. Williams) cannot find one word in this Amendment, which I presume he supports, to contradict the statement I have made. If he can find the words to support his murmer, perhaps he will tell me.

Mr. T. Williams

If the hon. Member wants to make a lengthy speech, and wants me to provide him with the matter, he will not get it from me this evening.

Mr. H. G. Williams

If the hon. Member has no views to express, he had better not murmer.

10.39 p.m.

Mr. Shinwell

May I direct the hon. Member's attention to the first part of the Amendment? It says: Where any facility, right, or privilege is required to enable the Commission to search or bore for coal in order that searching or boring may be effectively carried out the Commission shall have power to exercise such facility, right, or privilege subject to the payment of compensation to the person upon or through whose land the said operation, or either of them, is carried out. This right is, by the Bill, explicitly vested in the Commission, and the Amendment provides that the Commission shall have power to exercise the right. Why deny them the right which is explicit in the Bill?

Mr. Williams

Really, I wish that the bon. Member, who once was the Secretary for Mines, would not only take the trouble to read the Bill, but also to understand it. I am saying that under this Clause the Commission would have the right to destroy any amenity they like, and there is no challenge to that right. It has the right to search or bore, but it can only search or bore subject to the fact that they obtain permission to break the surface. This gives them an unqualified right to break the surface, and to invade the surface in any way they wish without the slightest consideration of the interests affected, of the amenities, and to destroy anything subject only to the check—and I agree that it is an important check—of the obligation to pay compensation. Perhaps the hon. Gentleman can tell me of any other check?

Mr. Shinwell

I will tell the hon. Member.

Mr. Williams

I shall be glad if the hon. Member will tell me now.

Mr. Shinwell

Will the hon. Member sit down?

Mr. Williams

No. I wish the hon. Member would do it before I sit down. I gave way once, and he read out certain words which had no bearing upon the point I am raising. It is extraordinary that the Labour party should seek to confer upon the Commission a dictatorial right which has never been conferred up till now by any Government of any kind.

10.42 p.m.

Mr. Shinwell

If it comes to a question of dictatorial rights. I imagine that the dictatorial privilege of the Patronage Secretary will be exercised, because certainly the hon. Member for South Croydon (Mr. H. G. Williams) is not making a helpful contribution to this particular Debate or to the passage of this Bill.

Mr. H. G. Williams

It is a rotten Bill, anyhow.

Mr. Shinwell

I understand that the hon. Member recognises the value of frankness. He simply has been talking a lot of unadulterated nonsense, and, not to put too fine a point upon it, he talks of my hon. and learned Friend the Member for East Bristol (Sir S. Cripps) seeking to assume the role of dictator. What has that to do with it? That is mere piffle, pabulum hyperbole, and a lot of other things I could mention. Let me direct the attention of the hon. Member to the governing section of the Bill which affects this Clause, and, therefore, affects this Amendment. The hon. Member has not participated in the discussion, and he does not know the first thing about the subject. We cannot excuse him for that, although we might excuse him for a good many other things of which he is guilty.

Mr. Williams

Answer the question.

Mr. Shinwell

May I direct the attention of the hon. Member to Clause 2, with which we are primarily concerned? In that Clause specific powers are vested in the Commission, and among these powers is the power to search and to bore for coal. That is the first point that is explicit in the Bill. The Commission are charged with that particular function. As to the question of dictatorship, let us see exactly where we stand. There is no question of the Commission exercising its powers to spare the amenities and all that sort of thing off its own bat without any consultation—nothing of the sort.

Mr. Williams

Consultation with whom?

Mr. Shinwell

If the hon. Member will allow me, I will tell him with whom the consultation must take place. Let him apply his ingenious mind to Sub-section (2) of Clause 2, when he will find that all these functions are subject to directions issued by the Board of Trade. There is, in fact, explicit in this Bill full parliamentary control. I will read the words: The Board of Trade may give to the Commission general directions as to the exercise and performance by the Commission of their functions under this Part of this Act in relation to matters appearing to the Board to affect the national interest. The Coal Commission are not empowered to do as they please. They cannot go rushing here and there all over the country. They are to have regard to the general directions vested in the Board of Trade and subject to the national interest and safety in the working of coal. Moreover, and this is an important factor which has escaped the attention of the hon. Member, there can be no actual interference with the rights of leaseholders. They are protected, and all that my hon. and learned Friend is asking is that the rights that are vested in those who have contracted with the Commission to work the leases should also be vested in the Commission itself. It is a perfectly legitimate request, and why the Secretary for Mines opposes it I do not know. Let me put this point to him: It is perfectly true that in Clause 18 Section 1 of the Mines (Working Facilities) Act, 1923, is abandoned, but surely he will recognise that the Commission is bound to operate within the limits of that Act of Parliament, which means a frequent recourse to the Railway and Canal Commission. Why should a Commission which is to assist in the reorganisation of the industry have to make frequent application to the Railway and Canal Commission? You are limiting, handicapping, and fettering the Commission. If the Commission has to exercise its functions under the general directions issued by the Board of Trade—

Mr. Williams

Will the hon. Member give me an answer about amenities?

Mr. Shinwell

I am not sure what the hon. Member means by amenities, unless he is thinking of the watercress beds in Croydon. I can give him an assurance on behalf of hon. Members on this side that there will be no interference with anything which exists in Croydon, and I am amazed at the hon. Member talking about amenities in this connection. Does he know anything about the coal areas of the country? Does he imagine that a coal undertaking concerns itself about amenities if it wishes to exploit the coal resources in a particular area? Of course not. I think the Commission will be more highly seized of the importance of protecting amenities in the public interest than coal undertakings ever were.

10.49 p.m.

Captain Crookshank

I do not want to prolong the Debate unduly, but the hon. and learned Member for East Bristol (Sir S. Cripps) asked why in this case the Commission was being treated differently from those who desired licences for boring for oil. The answer is that they are not. The hon. and learned Member was wrong in his facts. Licensees for oil can only get access by agreement, and if not they have recourse to the Railway and Canal Commission. A large number of licences have been granted, and there has not been any recourse to the courts; they have all got the facilities by agreement. Hon. Members have asked why should the same procedure be followed in this case. It is largely because Parliament has always been chary of giving to a statutory body compulsory acquisition powers to exploit an area.

Sir S. Cripps

I find no power to acquire these rights by agreement in the Bill. The only power is with the Railway and Canal Commission. If the hon. and gallant Member was going to give powers to acquire by agreement that would be some help, but there is absolutely no such power in the Bill.

Captain Crookshank

I will certainly look into that. I thought it was implicit. I am obliged to the hon. and learned Gentleman for calling my attention to it. The difference between compulsory acquisition on the lines that he suggests and what we propose is rather important because Parliament is always very chary of giving these powers, and it would be particularly in this case where there is already a process which has been in existence for some time past on somewhat analogous lines. The hon. and learned Gentleman said it would mean very expensive recourse to the court each time. I do not know that it is such a very expensive procedure, and I do not think probably there would be any difficulty on the ground that the Railway and Canal Commission would not be able to take a sufficiently wide look at the problem, but would have to decide each case individually. As this process is here it seems quite unnecessary, as we think it is adequate, to set up another kind of process with another kind of procedure.

Question put, "That those words be there added."

The Committee divided: Ayes, 121; Noes, 219.

Division No. 60.] AYES. [10.52 p.m.
Acland, R. T. D. (Barnstaple) Greenwood, Rt. Hon. A. Noel-Baker, P. J.
Adams, D. (Consett) Grenfell, D. R. Oliver, G. H.
Adams, D. M. (Poplar, S.) Griffith, F. Kingsley (M'ddl'sbro, W.) Paling, W.
Adamson, W. M. Griffiths, G. A. (Hemsworth) Parker, J.
Ammon, C. G. Hall, G. H. (Abordare) Price, M. P.
Anderson, F. (Whitehaven) Hall, J. H. (Whitechapel) Quibell, D. J. K.
Attlee, Rt. Hon. C. R. Hardie, Agnes Richards, R. (Wrexham)
Banfield, J. W. Harris, Sir P. A. Ridley, G.
Barnes, A. J. Harvey, T. E. (Eng. Univ's.) Riley, B.
Barr, J. Hayday, A. Ritson, J.
Batey, J. Henderson, A. (Kingswinford) Roberts, Rt. Hon. F. O. (W. Brom.)
Bellenger, F. J. Henderson, J. (Ardwick) Roberts, W. (Cumberland, N.)
Bevan, A. Henderson, T. (Tradeston) Salter, Or. A. (Bermondsey)
Broad, F. A. Hills, A. (Pontefract) Seely, Sir H. M.
Bromfield, W. Hollins, A. Sexton, T. M.
Brown, C. (Mansfield) Jagger, J. Shinwell, E.
Brown, Rt. Hon. J. (S. Ayrshire) Jenkins, A. (Pontypool) Silkin, L.
Buchanan, G. Johnston, Rt. Hon. T. Silverman, S. S.
Burke, W. A. Jones, A. C. (Shipley) Sinclair, Rt. Hon. Sir A. (C'thn's)
Cape, T. Jones, Sir H. Haydn (Merioneth) Smith, Ben (Rotherhithe)
Charleton, H. C. Kelly, W. T. Smith, E. (Stoke)
Chater, D. Kennedy, Rt. Hon. T. Smith, T. (Normanton)
Cluse, W. S. Kirby, B. V. Sorensen, R. W.
Cocks, F. S. Kirkwood, D. Stephen, C.
Cove, W. G. Lathan, G. Stewart, W. J. (H'ght'n-le-Sp'ng)
Cripps, Hon. Sir Stafford Lawson, J. J. Strauss, G. R. (Lambeth, N.)
Davidson, J. J. (Maryhill) Lee, F. Taylor, R. J. (Morpeth)
Davies, R. J. (Westhoughton) Leslie, J. R. Tinker, J. J.
Davies, S. O. (Merthyr) Logan, D. G. Walkden, A. G.
Dobbie, W. Lunn, W. Watkins, F. C.
Dunn, E. (Rother Valley) Macdonald, G. (Ince) Watson, W. McL.
Ede, J. C. McGhee, H. G. Westwood, J.
Edwards, Sir C. (Bedwellty) McGovern, J. Wilkinson, Ellen
Evans, E. (Univ. of Wales) MacLaren, A. Williams, E. J. (Ogmore)
Fletcher, Lt.-Comdr. R. T. H. Mainwaring, W. H. Williams, T. (Don Valley)
Gallacher, W. Mander, G. le M. Wilson, C. H. (Attercliffe)
Gardner, B. W. Messer, F. Windsor, W. (Hull, C.)
Garro Jones, G. M. Milner, Major J. Woods, G. S. (Finsbury)
George, Major G. Lloyd (Pembroke) Muff, G. Young, Sir R. (Newton)
George, Megan Lloyd (Anglesey) Nathan, Colonel H. L.
Green, W. H. (Deptford) Naylor, T. E. TELLERS FOR THE AYES.—Mr. Whiteley and Mr. Mathers.
NOES.
Acland-Troyte, Lt.-Col. G. J. Cartland, J. R. H. Dugdale, Captain T. L.
Agnew, Lieut.-Comdr. P. G. Cary, R. A. Eastwood, J. F.
Albery, Sir Irving Cazalet, Thelma (Islington, E.) Edmondson, Major Sir J.
Allen, Col. J. Sandeman (B'knhead) Cazalet, Capt. V. A. (Chippenham) Ellis, Sir G.
Allen, Lt.-Col. Sir W. J. (Armagh) Chamberlain, Rt. Hn. N. (Edgb't'n) Elliston, Capt. G. S.
Anderson, Sir A. Garrett (C. of Ldn.) Christie, J. A. Emery, J. F.
Anstruther-Gray, W. J. Clarke, Lt.-Col. R. S. (E. Grinstead) Emrys-Evans, P. V.
Aske, Sir R. W. Clarry, Sir Reginald Entwistle, Sir C. F.
Astor, Major Hon. J. J. (Dover) Colfox, Major W. P. Errington, E.
Astor, Hon. W. W. (Fulham, E.) Colman, N. C. D. Everard, W. L.
Atholl, Duchess of Calville, Lt.-Col. Rt. Hon. D. J. Fildes, Sir H.
Baldwin-Webb, Col. J. Conant, Captain R. J. E. Fleming, E. L.
Balfour, Capt. H. H. (Isle of Thanet) Cook, Sir T. R. A. M. (Norfolk, N.) Fox, Sir G. W. G.
Balniel, Lord Cooke, J. D, (Hammersmith, S.) Furness, S. N.
Barrio, Sir C. C. Cox, H. B. Trevor Fyie, D. P. M.
Baxter, A. Beverley Cranborne, Viscount Ganzoni, Sir J.
Beaumont, Hon. R. E. B. (Portsm'h) Crooke, J. S. Gledhill, G.
Crookshank, Capt. H. F. C. Gluckstein, L. H.
Beeenman, N. A. Croom-Johnson, R. P. Gower, Sir R. V.
Birchall, Sir J. D. Cross, R. H. Greene, W. P. C. (Wercester)
Bird, Sir R. B. Crossley, A. C. Grimston, R. V.
Bossom, A. C. Culverwell, C. T. Gritten, W. G. Howard
Boulton, W. W. Davidson, Viscountess Guest, Lieut.-Colonel H. (Drake)
Boyce, H. Leslie Davies, Major Sir G. F. (Yeovil) Guest, Maj. Hon. O. (C'mb'rw'll, N W)
Brass, Sir W. De Chair, S. S. Gunston, Capt. D. W.
Briscoe, Capt. R. G. Denman, Hon. R. D Hannah, I. C.
Brocklebank, Sir Edmund Denville, Alfred Hannon, Sir P. J. H.
Brown, Col. D. C. (Hexham) Doland, G. F. Harbord, A.
Brown, Brig.-Gen. H. C. (Newbury) Dorman-Smith, Major Sir R. H. Haslam, Sir J. (Bolton)
Bull, B. B. Duckworth, Arthur (Shrewsbury) Heilgers, Captain F. F. A.
Campbell, Sir E. T. Duckworth, W. Ft. (Moss Side) Hely-Hutchinson, M. R.
Heneage, Lieut.-Colonel A. P. Mills, Major J. D. (New Forest) Shepperson, Sir E. W.
Hepburn, P. G. T. Buchan Mitcheson, Sir G. G. Smith, Bracewell (Dulwich)
Hepworth, J. Moore, Lieut.-Col. Sir T. C. R. Smith, L. W. (Hallam)
Higgs, W. F. Morrison, G. A. (Scottish Univ's.) Smith, Sir R. W. (Aberdeen)
Holdsworth, H. Muirhead, Lt.-Col. A. J. Somervell, Sir O. B. (Crewe)
Holmes, J. S. Munro, P. Southby, Commander Sir A. R. J.
Horsbrugh, Florence Neven-Spence, Major B. H. H. Spens, W. P.
Hudson, Capt. A. U. M. (Hack., N.) Nicholson, Hon. H. G. Stanley, Rt. Hon. Oliver (W'm'l'd)
Hulbert, N. J. O'Connor, Sir Terence J. Stewart, J. Henderson (File, E.)
Hunter, T. O'Neill, Rt. Hon. Sir Hugh Stourton, Major Hon. J. J.
Hutchinson, G. C. Orr-Ewing, I. L. Strauss, E. A. (Southwark, N.)
Jarvis, Sir J. J. Palmer, G. E. H. Strauss, H. G. (Norwich)
Jones, L. (Swansea W.) Peak, O. Strickland, Captain W. F.
Keeling, E. H. Perkins, W. R. D. Stuart, Hon. J. (Moray and Nairn)
Kerr, Colonel C. I. (Montrose) Petherick, M. Sueter, Rear-Admiral Sir M. F.
Lamb, Sir J. Q. Pickthorn, K. W. M. Tasker, Sir R. I.
Law, Ft. K. (Hull, S. W.) Plugge, Capt. L. F. Taylor, C. S. (Eastbourne)
Lees-Jones, J. Ponsonby, Col. C. E. Taylor, Vice-Adm. E. A. (Padd., S.)
Lennox-Boyd, A. T. L. Porritt, R. W. Thomas. J. P. L.
Levy, T. Procter, Major H. A. Thomson, Sir J. D. W.
Llddall, W. S. Radford, E. A. Tufnell, Lieut.-Commander R. L.
Llewellin, Lieut.-Col. J. J. Rankin, Sir R. Turton, R. H.
Lloyd, G. W. Rathbone, J. R. (Bodmin) Wakefield, W. W.
Loftus, P. C. Reed, A. C. (Exeter) Walker-Smith, Sir J.
Lyons, A. M. Reid, Sir D. D. (Down) Wallace, Capt. Rt. Hon. Euan
Mabane, W. (Huddersfield) Reid, J. S. C. (Hillhead) Ward, Lieut.-Col. Sir A. L. (Hull)
MacAndrew, Colonel Sir C. G. Reid, VV. Allan (Derby) Ward, Irene M. B. (Wallsend)
MacDonald, Rt. Hon. M. (Ross) Rickards, G. W. (Skipton) Wardlaw-Milne, Sir J. S.
MacDonald, Sir Murdoch (Inverness) Robinson, J. R. (Blackpool) Waterhouse, Captain C.
McKie, J. H. Ropner, Colonel L. Wells, S. R.
Maclay, Hon. J. P. Ross Taylor, W. (Woodbridge) Whiteley, Major J. P. (Buckingham)
Macmillan, H. (Stockton-on-Tees) Rowlands, G. Williams, H. G. (Croydon, S.)
Macnamara, Capt. J. R. J. Royds, Admiral P. M. R. Willoughby de Eresby, Lord
Magnay, T. Ruggles-Brise, Colonel Sir E. A. Windsor-Clive, Lieut.-Colonel G.
Maitland, A. Russell, Sir Alexander Winterton, Rt. Hon. Earl
Makins, Brig.-Gen. E. Russell, R. J. (Eddisbury) Wise, A. R.
Manningham-Buller, Sir M. Salt, E. W. Womersley, Sir W. J.
Margesson, Capt. Rt. Hon H. D. R. Samuel, M. R. A. Wood, Hon. C. I. C.
Markham, S. F. Sanderson, Sir F. B. Wragg, H.
Marsden, Commander A. Sandys, E. D. Wright, Wing-Commander J. A. C.
Maxwell, Hon. S. A. Savery, Sir Servington Young, A. S. L. (Partick)
Mayhew, Lt.-Col. J. Scott, Lord William
Mellor, Sir J. S. P. (Tamworth) Selley, H. R. TELLERS FOR THE NOES.—
Captain Hope and Major Herbert.

Clause, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.