§ Motion made, and Question proposed, "That a sum, not exceeding £100 be granted to His Majesty, to make good Excesses of Army Expenditure beyond the Grants, for the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1902."
§ MR. WHITLEYsaid that if the Government had any regard for economy and improved methods of checking expenditure, they ought not to bring on a Vote of this kind at that hour of the morning and at that period of the session. He must say he was amazed when he looked into the Report of the Comptroller and Auditor-General on the accounts at the end of last financial year, that the Committee was not given a fuller opportunity of discussing and considering it. It would be quite sufficient to show the great seriousness of the matters concealed under this Report by calling the attention of the Committee to a few headings. For instance, the Auditor-General drew attention to the circumstances attending participation in fraud; to frauds at Aldershot connected with the payment of wages; to charges for transport insufficiently vouched; to irregularities in accounts; to imperfect vouching, etc. In one case the number of accounts which ought to 1392 have been furnished was sixty-three, but only thirteen had been returned, and of these some were of little value. He maintained that this Vote—which involved several millions of pounds—should not be carried through sub silentio and without full and satisfactory explanation by those responsible; and he begged to move the reduction of the Vote by £99.
§ Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the sum of £1 be granted for the said service."—(Mr. Whitley.)
§ * SIR A. HAYTERsaid he quite agreed with the hon. Member that it was very unsatisfactory that the Reports of the Public Accounts Committee, who fully examined these accounts, and of the Auditor-General had not been brought before the House of Commons as was recommended by the National Expenditure Committee. The fact was that it was exceedingly difficult to carry on war expenditure by Estimates, and the War Office must be allowed considerable latitude. Many of the accounts referred to by the hon. Member had been carefully examined by the Public Accounts Committee, who were of the unanimous opinion, and recommended to the House, that a total Vote should be granted in order to make up deficiencies.
§ MR. WHITLEYsaid that before presenting the matter to the Committee he had taken the precaution of submitting it to the Chairman of the Public Accounts. Committee; and he thought that the Report of the Public Accounts Committee called for some statement from the Government as to the action that would be taken to prevent similar irregularities in the future.
§ Question put.
1393| The Committee divided:—Ayes, 25; Noes, 116. (Division List No. 208.) |
| AYES. | ||
| Barran, Rowland Hirst | Griffith, Ellis J. | Sinclair, John (Forfarshire) |
| Bolton, Thomas Dolling | Helme, Norval Watson | Soares, Ernest J. |
| Buchanan, Thomas Ryburn | Levy, Maurice | Sullivan, Donal |
| Caldwell, James | M'Laren, Sir Charles Benj. | Weir, James Galloway |
| Cawley, Frederick | Moss, Samuel | White, Luke (York. E. R.) |
| Cremer, William Randal | O'Brien, P. J. (Tipperary, N.) | |
| Dalziel, James Henry | Partington, Oswald | TELLERS FOR THE AYES |
| Dewar, John A. (Inverness-sh.) | Priestley, Arthur | Mr. Whitley and Mr |
| Dilke, Rt. Hon. Sir Charles | Samuel, Herbt, L.(Cleveland) | Lough. |
| Emmott, Alfred | Shackleton, David James |
| NOES. | ||
| Anson, Sir William Reynell | Hamilton, Rt. Hn. Ld. G. (Mid'x | Pryce-Jones, Lt.-Col. Edward |
| Arkwright, John Stanhope | Harris, Frederick Leverton | Purvis, Robert |
| Arnold-Forster, Hugh O. | Hayne, Rt. Hon. Charles Seale- | Randles, John S. |
| Atkinson, Right Hon. John | Hayter, Rt Hon Sir Arthur D. | Rasch, Major Frederic Carne |
| Balfour, Rt. Hn. A. J. (Man'r | Heath, Arthur H. (Hanley) | Reid, James (Greenock) |
| Balfour, Rt. Hn. G. W. (Leeds | Heath, James (Staffords., N. W. | Remnant, Jas. Farquharson |
| Bentinck, Lord Henry C. | Hogg, Lindsay | Renwick, George |
| Blundell, Colonel Henry | Kemp, Lieut.-Colonel George | Ritchie, Rt. Hn, C. Thomson |
| Boscawen, Arthur Griffith | Kennaway, Rt. Hon. Sir J. H. | Ropner, Colonel Sir Robert |
| Brodrick, Rt. Hon. St. John | Keswick, William | Round, Rt. Hon. James |
| Campbell, J. H. M. (Dublin Univ | Law, Andrew Bonar (Glasgow | Rutherford, John (Lancashire |
| Cavendish, V C W (Derbysh.) | Lawson, John Grant(Yorks, NR | Sackville, Col. S. G. Stopford |
| Cecil, Evelyn (Aston Manor) | Legge, Col. Hon. Heneage | Scott, Sir S. (Marylebone, W.) |
| Chamberlain, Rt Hon J (Birm | Leveson-Gower, Frederiek N.S. | Seely, Charles Hilton (Lincoln) |
| Chamberlain, Rt Hn. J A (Worc | Loder, Gerald Walter Erskine | Seely, Maj. J.E.B. (Isle of Wight |
| Chapman, Edward | Lonsdale, John Brownlee | Sinclair, Louis (Romford) |
| Charrington, Spencer | Lowther, C. (Cumb, Eskdale) | Smith, Abel H. (Hertford, E.) |
| Cochrane, Hon. Thos. H. A. E. | Lucas, Reg'ld J. (Portsmouth) | Smith, James Parker(Lanarks. |
| Colomb, Sir John Charles Ready | Lyttelton, Hon. Alfred | Smith, Hn. W. F. D. (Strand) |
| Corbett, T. L.(Down, North) | Macdona, John Cumming | Spear, John Ward |
| Craig, Charles Curtis (Antrim, S | M'Arthur, Charles (Liverpool) | Stanley, Hon, Arthur (Ormskirk |
| Cranborne, Viscount | M'Arthur, William (Cornwall) | Stanley, Lord (Lancs.) |
| Crossley, Rt. Hon. Sir Savile | M'Killop, Jas. (Stirlingshire) | Sturt, Hn. Humphrey Napier |
| Davenport, William Bromley | Majendie, James A. H. | Talbot, Lord E. (Chichester) |
| Dickson, Charles Scott | Maxwell, W.J.H. (Dumfriessh.) | Thornton, Percy M. |
| Douglas, Rt. Hon. A. Akers | Milvain, Thomas | Tollemache, Henry James |
| Duke, Henry Edward | Morgan, D. J. (Walthamstow) | Tomlinson, Sir Wm. E. M. |
| Elliot, Hon. A. Ralph Douglas | Morrell, George Herbert | Ure, Alexander |
| Faber, E. B. (Hants, W.) | Morrison, James Archibald | Valentia, Viscount |
| Faber, George Denison (York) | Murray, Rt. Hn A. Graham (Bute | Walker, Col. William Hall |
| Fellowes, Hon. Ailwyn Ed. | Murray, Charles J. (Coventry) | Walrond, Rt. Hn. Sir Wm. H. |
| Fergusson, Rt Hn Sir J. (Manc'r | Murray, Col. Wyndham (Bath) | Warde, Colonel C. E. |
| Fitzroy, Hon. Edward Algernon | Nolan, Col. John P. (Galway, N. | Wortley, Rt. Hon. C. B. Stuart |
| Forster, Henry William | Palmer, Walter (Salisbury) | Wrightson, Sir Thomas |
| Fyler, John Arthur | Parkes, Ebenezer | Wylie, Alexander |
| Gordon, J. (Londonderry, S.) | Peel, Hn Wm. Robert Wellesley | Wyndham, Rt. Hon. George |
| Gore, Hn G. R. C. Ormsby-(Salop | Percy, Earl | |
| Greene, Hy. D. (Shrewsbury) | Pierpoint, Robert | TELLERS FOR THE NOES— |
| Greene, W. Raymond (Cambs | Platt-Higgins, Frederick | Sir Alexander Acland- |
| Guest, Hon. Ivor Churchill | Pretyman, Ernest George | Hood and Mr. Anstruther |
§ Resolutions to be reported this day; Committee to sit again this day.