§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENI beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, has he observed that at the Mullingar Quarter Sessions, in the proclaimed county of Westmeath, there was no criminal case for trial except a charge of burglary against a soldier, and that the Grand Jury unanimously passed a resolution respectfully requesting the Government to remove the proclamation of the county on account of its peaceful and crimeless condition; whether he is aware that County Court Judge Curran, who presided, tore up the resolution and threw the pieces of paper towards the Grand Jury, and, when one 241 of the Grand Jury asked to be informed of any case of boycotting in the county, the judge threatened him with imprisonment; and seeing that Grand Juries in Ireland have habitually passed resolutions dealing with the state of the country which have been received by the judges, will the Government take any steps to secure the freedom of speech of Grand Juries, when respectfully representing to the Government the crimelessness of proclaimed districts.
§ MR. WYNDHAMI have seen a newspaper account of the proceedings in question. The learned judge is reported to have congratulated the Grand Jury on the freedom of the district from ordinary crime. He expressed regret, however, at the introduction of the, "thin edge of boycotting,'' and referred, from his lengthened experience, to the serious result of the system. To what extent the newspaper report is an accurate record of what took place I cannot say. The Government has no responsibility in the matter mentioned in the concluding part of the Question.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENMay I ask whether the Chief Secretary has given us an official communication from the countycourt judge; and whether it is not a fact that all the newspapers reported that after tearing up the resolution and throwing it at the Grand Jury the judge said, "There's your precious resolution"? Will the right hon. Gentleman inform Judge Curran that if on a question of local knowledge twenty-three Grand Jurymen living in the neighbourhood——
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order ‡ This is really making a speech on the Question.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENI think you might allow me to finish my Question. When I have put it I will bow at once to your ruling. What I desire to ask is whether, if a difference of opinion arises on a local matter between the judge and the jury, the Chief Secretary will inform the judge that the difference of opinion ought not to be treated as a crime for which Grand Jurors are to be committed to prison?
§ MR. WYNDHAMNo, Sir; I never make communications to judges.
§ MR. SWIFT MACNEILLIt is very hard to put a Question amid the bursts of laughter of the hon. Members opposite who do not know what imprisonment is.
§ MR. MACVEAGHSome of them do.
§ MR. SWIFT MACNEILLYes. Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that this Judge Curran is to try Mr. O'Donnell's appeal?
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order‡ That does not arise out of the Question.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENIn reference to the last reply of the Chief Secretary, might I ask the Prime Minister whether, now that the County Courts in Ireland form a portion of the exceptional tribunals——
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order.‡ The hon. Member cannot ask a Question of the Prime Minister now.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENWhy not? I have asked them hundreds of times.
§ * MR. SPEAKERBecause the Question on the Paper is disposed of, and the proper order is to take the next Question.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENWell, but Mr. Speaker, this is a Question entirely and directly arising out of the answer of the Chief Secretary.
§ * MR. SPEAKERThe hon. Member's Question was addressed to a different Minister altogether, and he cannot interpolate Questions to any Minister.
§ MR. WILLIAM O'BRIENThen I shall put the Question to the Chief Secretary himself. I beg to ask him whether, having regard to his answer that it is not possible for him at present to address any communications to county court judges in reference to any controversial questions, he will not recommend that the salaries of those judges should be taken off the Consolidated Fund, so that it may be possible for us to criticise their action?
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order ‡ That does not arise out of the Question.
§ MR. MURPHY (Kerry, E.)May I ask the Chief Secretary why Judge Curran was removed——
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order. That does not arise out of the Question.
§ MR. MURPHYWill you allow me to complete it?
§ * MR. SPEAKERNo, I will not.
§ MR. MURPHYThen I will put it down.
§ MR. DELANYDo not the criminal statistics for the last three months show—
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order ‡ That does not arise out of the Question.
§ MR. DELANYShow there is no crime——
§ * MR. SPEAKEROrder, order ‡