HC Deb 22 January 1990 vol 165 cc607-8
5. Mr. Ron Davies

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales how many units of local authority-provided sheltered accommodation for the elderly currently exist in Wales.

Mr. Grist

At 1 April 1989 there were 16,219 units of sheltered accommodation for elderly people provided by local authorities in Wales.

Mr. Davies

Will the Minister confirm that under the new ringfencing arrangements local authorities will have to exclude the costs of warden services from their housing accounts, and will therefore no longer be eligible for housing subsidy? Does he realise that the full cost of warden services will then fall on the poll tax? The Minister's estimate of poll tax in the Rhymney valley of £166 per head has already increased on the basis of the local authority estimate of £225 per head. That seems to generate laughter from the Secretary of State. Will the Minister seriously reconsider those elements of local authority expenditure that should be eligible for housing subsidy?

Mr. Grist

The hon. Gentleman overlooks the considerable increase in funds that are being made available next year to local authorities for housing and through the Housing Corporation for mixed housing in sheltered accommodation. The hon. Gentleman can look there for considerable growth. The effect of the pay of wardens on the community charge will be infinitesimal compared with the good that will be done by sheltered accommodation.

Mr. Michael

Will the Minister compare his figure of 16,200 units of accommodation with the anticipated increase in the number of elderly—48,000 over the next 20 years—and with the figure for the very elderly, those over 85, of 26,000? Given the emphasis on community care and on people being enabled to live independent lives, will he provide the money to enable local authorities to undertake rapid acceleration in the provision of sheltered accommodation?

Mr. Grist

The hon. Gentleman should consider that we have been able to provide the finance for an increase of more than 3,000 units of accommodation for elderly people in the last two and a half years. We shall be able to maintain that rate in future. He will also be aware of the new renovation grants scheme that will considerably assist private elderly owners in Wales, of whom we have a high proportion and for whom local authorities will have an unlimited financial draw on the Treasury.