HC Deb 08 July 1987 vol 119 cc349-52
14. Mr. Beith

asked the Chencellor of the Duchy of Lancaster when he next plans to meet the chairman of British Telecom to discuss consumer interests.

Mr. Butcher

My right hon. and noble Friend met the chairman of British Telecom last week. Consumer interests were amongst the matters discussed. My right hon. and learned Friend also expects to meet the chairman soon.

Mr. Beith

Will the Minister tell the chairman that the results of the consumer survey and the report of the official monitoring body demonstrate that British Telecom's privileged monopoly position is allowing it to treat its consumers appallingly badly? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that, during my time as a Member of Parliament, I have never heard so many complaints about the telephone service and that in my consitutency the public telephone call box service is on the verge of collapse because it is not adequately maintained, the money is not emptied from the boxes and the service is disgraceful?

Mr. Butcher

This Government's legislation has beefed up consumers' rights to make representations through the Director General of Telecommunications. It is for the director general, if he finds abuse of that monopoly position, to request a change in licence conditions. I should have thought that that would be welcomed by both sides of the House. It would be unwise for me to comment at the moment on the survey. It will go to Oftel's director general. I understand that the survey was carried out between 6 and 10 March when BT was still affected by the aftermath of the National Communications Union strike action.

Mr. Hayward

Are not people forgetting the problems faced by consumers, both individual and business, before BT was privatised? Was it not common for consumers to wait 26 weeks for any particular piece of equipment before privatisation and liberalisation?

Mr. Butcher

Yes, there were immense difficulties pre-privatisation, especially for business users. Our programme of liberalisation of the supply of peripheral equipment to those users had a great effect. It is interesting to note that, by comparison with one of our major competitors, Germany, the cost of our business lines per business user is now significantly better than that for German business men. We should welcome the fact that alternative network provisions for business users are now being completed through the network supplied by Mercury.

Mr. Allen

When the Minister next meets the chairman of British Telecom, will he raise with him the subject of blind and disabled persons and demand guarantees that they will not be charged for directory inquiry services? Will he then make that statement public?

Mr. Butcher

BT's licence allows it to charge for directory inquiries. However, BT must provide services to blind and disabled persons free of charge or with reasonable compensation. We bore this matter very much in mind when framing the original legislation and enshrining the rights of the hard of hearing.

Mr. Aitken

Does my hon. Friend understand that the OFTEL organisation does not seem to many people to be doing a vigorous enough job in defending the interests of consumers against the monopoly that currently exists? Will my hon. Friend consider two areas of concern? The first is the apparent discrimination against Mercury customers, and the other is the discrimination against small independent engineers who wish to fit all sorts of extension devices to customers' equipment, but are unable to do so because of British Telecom's stranglehold on the master switches, which is apparently defended at the moment by OFTEL. That is a totally unacceptable situation.

Mr. Butcher

The Director General must publish an annual report and it is on that basis that we make judgments on his efficacy. My hon. Friend has raised two serious matters. When we next meet the Director General of OFTEL, with whom we have periodic meetings, I shall ensure that those two items are on the agenda.

Mr. Flannery

Is it not a fact that, despite what the Government say and all the gimmickry, the telephone system is now worse than it was? [Interruption.] At lunch time I had to telephone on three occasions and had difficulty in getting the number that I wanted. Everybody to whom I speak says that that is happening and that telephones are giving small tinkles and rings at times when nobody is ringing. Why will the Government not admit that something is wrong, because only when they admit that something is wrong will they try to set it right?

Mr. Butcher

Waiting lists for telephones numbered 200,000 prior to privatisation. That is now almost eliminated. On the question of business use, I can recall from vivid personal experience that if one wished to get a modem from the old BT network one had to put one's name down and was privileged to receive it within five or six months. We do not say that all is universally well with BT. We say that it should be held to account and where it abuses its monopoly position we have given the DG OFTEL powers to request variations on licence conditions, which, in my view is an effective sanction.

Mr. Grylls

Does my hon. Friend agree that any supplier or company as large as BT, with still a dominant market share, will attract a good deal of criticism, because that is what people are like and what happens? However, as my hon. Friends have said, it would be unwise not to recognise that there has been a huge improvement throughout the service and a massive investment programme in British Telecom of thousands of millions of pounds, which has benefited large and small firms up and down the country and which, to a large extent, has been responsible for creating many new jobs, which we all welcome.

Mr. Butcher

My hon. Friend is exactly right. There has been a massive investment programme. Since 1983 an additional 2 million exchange lines have been installed. Our consumer and business expectations are increasing and that is exactly right. However, through the regulatory and other mechanisms, we must ensure that BT delivers according to customer preferences.

Mr. Alan Williams

Instead of quoting the odd selective statistic, why does the Minister not force British Telecom to publish the comprehensive consumer figures that it used to publish when it was in public ownership? Will he now admit that British Telecom has become a sick private joke? Its enormous profits come solely from the fact that it uses its monopoly power to milk the domestic consumer, and it has shown itself to be completely incapable of operating a public telephone kiosk system. Does the Minister condone the latest abuse of its monopoly power—the imposition of blackmail premium charges on those of its customers who have the temerity to want their telephones repaired in a reasonable time?

Mr. Butcher

The right hon. Gentleman's comments had more to do with his dogmatic antipathy towards privatisation than with the facts. During the past three years controlled telephone prices have declined in real terms by just over 8 per cent., thanks to the RPI minus three formula. I do not recall that happening when British Telecom was in public ownership. Last November's changes resulted in an average reduction of 0.3 per cent. For the average domestic consumer OFTEL estimates an increase of 1.9 per cent., which is still a fall in real terms. The right hon. Gentleman went right over the top. In empowering the regulators to call for precisely the sort of information that he defined, we gave them the teeth to keep the public better informed.