HC Deb 11 June 1986 vol 99 cc324-6
13. Mr. Tom Cox

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will make it his policy, as President of the European Economic Community Council, to initiate a review of relations between member states and South Africa; and if he will make a statement.

Sir Geoffrey Howe

The Foreign Ministers of the 12 regularly discuss the situation in South Africa at their meetings. The next such meeting will take place on 16 June. Foreign Ministers of the 12 will continue to meet to review policy during the British Presidency.

Mr. Cox

Is the Foreign Secretary aware that he, as the President of the EEC Council, will have enormous influence on the attitude of the other 11 members? As the situation worsens week by week in South Africa, and in view of the comments on the attitude of South Africa by the Eminent Persons Group, what else has to happen in that country before the Government start to give decisive leadership against the actions and attitudes of the South African Government? Are we for ever to be making excuses? Are we for ever to be dragging our feet? When will we give some leadership?

Sir Geoffrey Howe

The Government have condemned the apartheid system without reservation and have made it plain that it ought to go and go as quickly as possible. It is to that end that we have supported the work of the Commonwealth Eminent Persons Group, whose report is now in our hands and will be considered. When the EC Foreign Ministers met the front-line states in February this year they made it clear that that group's report deserves consideration by them as well.

Mr. Adley

As my right hon. and learned Friend's presidency will, as he has just said, coincide with the publication of the Eminent Persons Group's report, will he give himself the priority of doing his best to align the policies of the EEC, the Commonwealth and Her Majesty's Government.

Sir Geoffrey Howe

As my hon. Friend will have noticed, the positions adopted by the Community at Luxembourg last September, and subsequently by the Commonwealth in the following month, were closely in line with each other.

Mr. Healey

Now that the Commonwealth Eminent Persons Group has reported that no progress is likely to be made towards a peaceful settlement in South Africa unless the external powers impose new sanctions on the Botha regime, will the Foreign Secretary persuade the Prime Minister to abandon her pig-headed opposition to sanctions, which has identified Britain as the only protector of apartheid in the outside world, has split the European Community and now threatens to break up the Commonwealth?

Sir Geoffrey Howe

The right hon. Gentleman's comment is characteristically inaccurate. The European Community's position has been the common position since September last year. The Commonwealth's position has been the common position since last October. It is important that full and careful consideration should now be given to the report of the Commonwealth Eminent Persons Group. We all share the common aim of bringing about an early end to apartheid in South Africa and, if possible, of achieving that without violence through a process of dialogue.

Mr. Dalyell

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In a week when the luck of the ballot gave Ministers an opportunity to answer questions legitimately put by a Select Committee of the House —the Select Committee on Foreign Affairs—is it tactful for the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, the hon. Member for Enfield, North (Mr. Eggar), to lecture my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) on the democratic process?

Mr. Speaker

Order. I have already made a comment about that. It is not a matter for me.

Later—

Mr. Corbyn

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. Is it in order for a Minister, when answering a question in the House, to suggest that Members of Parliament who take part in demonstrations outside the House on matters about which they feel strongly are acting in an undemocratic manner? Is it not the case that democracy means that people have a right to speak freely in the House and also a right to speak freely and to demonstrate outside the House on matters about which they feel strongly?

Mr. Speaker

I am not responsible for what the hon. Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn), does outside the House. It is perfectly in order for him to demonstrate if that is what he wishes to do. Every hon. Member takes responsibility for what he says in the House.

Mr. Marlow

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker

Will it help?

Mr. Marlow

Could you confirm to the hon. Gentleman in case he is in any doubt, that although any hon. Member is entitled to demonstrate and speak freely, he is not entitled to break the law?

Mr. Speaker

Order. That goes for all our citizens.

Mr. Bowen Wells

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. Will you confirm that Question Time had been completed by the time you permitted a point of order to be raised by the hon. Member for Linlithgow (Mr. Dalyell)?

Mr. Speaker

Today Question Time ran slightly over to

3.31 pm

Mr. Wareing

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. Is it in order for the hon. Member for Northampton, North (Mr. Marlow) to imply that by taking part in demonstrations my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) has been involved in illegal activities? I understand—

Mr. Speaker

Order. I have already dealt with that matter.

Mr. Corbyn

rose—

Mr. Speaker

Further interventions do not help. I have given the hon. Gentleman my protection. What else does he want?

Mr. Corbyn

I am deeply grateful for your protection of democratic rights inside and outside the House, Mr. Speaker. I am sure you would also like it to be placed correctly on the record—because the hon. Member for Northampton, North (Mr. Marlow) obviously reads the headlines, not the stories—that I have not been charged with any offence arising from any actions that took place outside the Old Bailey on Monday morning.

Mr. Speaker

Order. Let us get on with something that is my responsibility.