HC Deb 29 November 1983 vol 49 c753
9. Mr. Kirkwood

asked the Secretary of State for Defence whether he is satisfied with the efficacy of established procedures to scrutinise the control of spending in the departments under his control.

Mr. Heseltine

Like other Government Departments, the Ministry of Defence has well established arrangements for the internal audit of all systems of financial control and regular reports are made to the accounting officers. The arrangements have been strengthened by the creation of the post of director general of management audit, whose organisation provides independent appraisals of the efficiency with which resources are used. The Ministry is now embarked on a major programme of improvements to financial management, including MINIS—the management information system for ministers and top management—and the extension of accountable management through a system of responsibility budgets for line managers.

Mr. Kirkwood

Returning to the important supplementary question asked by the hon. Member for Fife, Central (Mr. Hamilton), does the Secretary of State accept that if the allegations in The Observer of 13 November are correct and there is waste, inefficiency and vast overspending it is time for an urgent and public independent efficiency audit of every penny spent by the Department?

Mr. Heseltine

Given the volume of comment always made about all Government Departments, it would not be appropriate to react in that way. Nevertheless, as I said in relation to earlier questions, I take these things seriously and I shall satisfy myself about all the points raised before letting the matter drop.

Mr. Latham

Have the established procedures properly costed the so-called savings from the closure of the Gibraltar dockyard, amounting to about one third of the cost of a new ship? Is my right hon. Friend aware that many of us believe that there will be no savings at all?

Mr. Heseltine

I believe that these matters were carefully considered when the decision was taken. We concluded that rationalisation would save money and manpower and concentrate the work to be undertaken on behalf of the Royal Navy in British shipyards.

Mr. Douglas

Will the Secretary of State be more forthcoming about the MINIS system, especially in relation to the dockyards? Will he give us an idea of the loading of the yards and an assurance about the continued employment of the personnel there?

Mr. Heseltine

The object of the MINIS system is to provide the maximum possible opportunity for informed discussion among Ministers, senior officials and those responsible for running public sector organisations. The House will be familiar with the system, as full details were made available in relation to the Department of the Environment.