§ Q2. Mr. Sheermanasked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for 22 December.
§ The Prime MinisterThis morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today. This evening I hope to have an audience of her Majesty the Queen.
§ Mr. SheermanWill the Prime Minister take time today to explain to parents why, as was confirmed by a Minister in the early hours of this morning, the Government are running down British universities and thereby depriving 20,000 young men and women a year of the opportunity of a better life? Will she also explain what that action will contribute to the process of international competitiveness, which she holds so dear to her heart, or so she tells us?
§ The Prime MinisterThe grant to the University Grants Committee is about £900 million. The UGC is responsible for allocating that money. As the hon. Gentleman knows, there was a massive expansion of university places during my time as Secretary of State for Education and Science and a massive expansion of the number of people in teaching. There has been a massive expansion of university places over previous years, though it is true that there are now certain economies in university expenditure.
Competitiveness does not necessarily depend on the number of people at universities. As the hon. Gentleman will know, there has been an increase in the allocation of money for engineering and scientific places.
§ Mr. David SteelIs the Prime Minister aware that in her new year message, published yesterday, her assertion that 1982 has all the signs of being a year of great opportunity for Britain——
§ Mr. SkinnerNot for the right hon. Gentleman.
§ Mr. SkinnerThe SDP is gobbling up the right hon. Gentleman.
§ Mr. SteelIs the Prime Minister aware that her assertion would have been more convincing if she had remembered that she said in her new year message for 1981: that
there is real hope that a year from now things will be looking distinctly brighter.
§ The Prime MinisterMay I just give the right hon. Gentleman one or two figures to show that things really are very much better in some respects than at this time last year? For example, with regard to output per hour per person, which is an important measure of productivity, the figure for the third quarter of this year, on an indexed basis, is 115, which is an all-time record. The figure for output per person employed, another measure of productivity is 113.2, another all-time record. That is very good news.
§ The Prime MinisterI am sorry that the right hon. Member for Stepney and Poplar (Mr. Shore) does not like increased productivity. Of course he does not. I do not intend to answer questions that the right hon. Gentleman asks from a sedentary position. The only way to get more business is for us to have greater productivity. The right hon. Gentleman knows that. Many people in industry are saying that they are in a better environment than for many years and they are well poised to take advantage of an increase in world trade when it comes.
§ Mr. David AtkinsonReturning to the subject of Poland, did my right hon. Friend hear the "World at One" programme, which referred to the Austrian request for this country to receive a fair share of the refugees, including handicapped people, recently arrived in Austria? Can my right hon. Friend make a statement on that request?
§ The Prime MinisterNo. I have no statement to make on that. As I said in an earlier reply, a number of Polish people who were on a visit to this country are staying here for the time being until we see how the situation in Poland develops.
§ Mr. Alfred MorrisWill the Prime Minister reflect, between her engagements today, on the shocking increase in unemployment among employable disabled people? Is she aware that it is now reported to be as high as 80 per cent. in some parts of the United Kingdom? Will the right hon. Lady also reflect on the hardship caused for 650,000 chronically sick and disabled people and their families by the Government's cut in invalidity benefit during this International Year of Disabled People? Bearing in mind the resolution approved by the House on 3 July, what action is the Prime Minister taking to reverse that and other cuts in the living standards of disabled people?
§ The Prime MinisterI believe that I am right in saying that the invalidity pension had added to it a temporary allowance that brought it back up to what it would otherwise have been——
§ Mr. Alfred MorrisNo, that is not so.
§ The Prime MinisterI am sorry if that is not specifically correct. I had the figures with me last week. Perhaps the right hon. Gentleman will put down a specific question, or perhaps he should have asked the Secretary of State for Social Services when he was answering 869 questions earlier. There is an extra amount which, I thought, brought up the invalidity pension to the level that it would otherwise have been.
I am afraid that at a time of considerable unemployment, although the general overall figures are slightly down, it is very difficult to get extra places for disabled people, but those who are in work are doing a splendid job.
Later—
§ Mr. Alfred MorrisOn a point of order, Mr. Speaker. Many people inside and outside the House may have been seriously misled by the Prime Minister's reply to me——
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. We cannot deal with a Minister's reply—that of the Prime Minister or of any other Minister—on a point of order.
§ Q3. Mr. Alan Clarkasked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 22 December.
§ The Prime MinisterI refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
§ Mr. ClarkIn considering what action to take about Poland, will my right hon. Friend ensure that nothing is done to add to the tribulations of the Polish people, who are more deserving of sympathy than punishment? Further, will she devote her personal prestige to bringing about a response from the free nations of Europe that is positive, resolute and, in contrast to what happened over Afghanistan, united?
§ The Prime MinisterThis is one of the problems that we have in deciding what to do about withholding supplies from the Polish people. We wish to ease the lot of the Polish people. We must ensure that any food that is sent reaches them. Decisions will have to be made about the grant that we were giving the Ursus tractor factory. Another £30 million was due to go next year, and in concert with our allies in Europe we shall have to decide whether to send that amount. We shall also have to decide with our allies about the possibility of rescheduling debts. At the moment we are having consultations. There is a fresh round of consultation with our European colleagues and NATO Allies, and NATO ambassadors are meeting tomorrow.
§ Dr. OwenIs the Prime Minister aware that not everyone supports her denunciation of what is happening in Poland?
§ Mr. CanavanLook at the time.
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. May I inform the House that we were one minute late in reaching Prime Minister's questions.
§ Dr. OwenThe real anxiety in the country is over what action is to be taken. It appears that again, as in the case of Afghanistan, the West is not prepared to cross the real threshold, which is a readiness to threaten economic sanctions. Are we really to believe that over the next few weeks we shall continue to fund the military Government in Poland, while we see what: is happening in that country? [Interruption.] Are we to continue to have free and open trading with Poland while—(Interruption]—we see what is happening on the television news?
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. It is beyond reason for hon. Members to shout alongside a right hon. Member who is trying to address the House. All right hon. and hon. Members are entitled to be heard when they are called.
§ Mr. CanavanThe right hon. Gentleman should tell us about his support for the Shah.
§ Dr. OwenThe Prime Minister should recognise that there is a real feeling in the country that denunciation is not enough and that we should be prepared, along with other European countries, to pay a fair price.
§ The Prime MinisterI think that I have already fairly answered a number of the right hon. Gentleman's questions. We shall of course need to be certain that any aid will not strengthen the forces of oppression. Many of us feel that it would not necessarily help the Polish people to cut off all food supplies this side of Christmas. It would be better to ensure that the supplies reach the people themselves. As I said, we are consulting our allies about, whether the debt should be rescheduled and what should happen about the grant that we had previously intended to give to the Ursus tractor factory. We are well aware of these matters, but they are not nearly as easy to deal with as the right hon. Gentleman suggests.