HC Deb 08 June 1978 vol 951 cc344-8
3. Mr. Ashton

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department when he expects the White Paper on the Annan Report on broadcasting to be published.

14. Mr. Ioan Evans

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department when he proposes to publish his plans for the future of television broadcasting.

19. Mr. McCrindle

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he is yet in a position to announce future policy on local radio.

24. Mr. Whitehead

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he can now announce the date for the publication of his White Paper on broadcasting.

Mr. Merlyn Rees

The Government are still considering the many issues raised in the Annan Committee's Report. I am not yet in a position to say when our proposals for the future constitution, structure and organisation of broadcasting will be ready for publication.

Mr. Ashton

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the section in the Annan Report on television licensing was totally unsatisfactory, and virtually glossed over the subject? Is he further aware that there is a strong feeling that television licences should be abolished and that they should be paid for out of taxation?

Mr. Alexander W. Lyon

Hear, hear.

Mr. Ashton

Will my right hon. Friend take account of this matter in his White Paper, together with the fact that many people feel strongly on this issue?

Mr. Rees

I certainly will take that matter into account. It is one of about 174 matters which have to be brought before the House of Commons. We might as well face this matter before the discussion takes place. The BBC feels very strongly that if it were financed directly from the Treasury, it would inhibit its freedom and the kind of development which has taken place over the years. When we bring forward the response to the Annan Report, it will be an admirable subject to discuss in November, December, January, February, March and April.

Mr. Evans

Does my right hon. Friend realise that although we wish to maintain the independence of the BBC, a growing number of people feel that there should be a method of raising finance other than the licence? Will he look closely at this matter? It would be a most attractive proposal to put to the country—another method of raising revenue for the BBC, rather than the licence—as most households now have television. Will he also tell us, prior to the announcement of the complete proposals, what proposals are contemplated for the fourth channel?

Mr. Rees

There is a problem about the fourth channel, and a channel for Wales. We shall give our views on Annan in the White Paper. I tried to indicate earlier that the merit of a White Paper following the report was that there would be room for further discussion, because practically every issue that comes up in Annan is capable of being discussed and divided upon. In my view, the legislation will make devolution look very simple.

Mr. McCrindle

Dealing directly with the matter of local radio, is the Home Secretary aware that, while we await the Government's reactions to the Annan Report, there are vast areas of this country, particularly in East Anglia, which have no local radio station, either BBC or independent? Will the Home Secretary turn his attention to the possibility of dealing with this matter, possibly on an interim basis?

Mr. Rees

I think that in whatever form we answer the proposals in the Annan Report, which will be relatively soon, we can make a move well in advance of the major proposals on local broadcasting.

Mr. Whitehead

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that the Home Department's gestation period for this matter has been rather longer than that of an elephant? It has been hard on those of us who were trying to impregnate the beast in the first place. Will he give an undertaking that there will be time for a debate on the White Paper before the recess and that there will be proposals, either in the manifesto or the Queen's Speech, as the case may be, particularly in view of the cynical attitude of the Opposition in embracing the commercial lobby which wishes to extend the present duopoly?

Mr. Rees

I cannot give a commitment about the manifesto; that is a long way ahead and we need not put our minds to that. Whether there will be a debate is not a matter for me, either. I am keen to publish the White Paper. We certainly need an extensive discussion before I bring forward legislation next year.

Mr. Fairbairn

On the question of licence fees, which was raised by the hon. Member for Bassetlaw (Mr. Ashton), does the Home Secretary appreciate that it would be abominably unfair to make those who watch television have their licences paid out of taxation, as if taxation were paid by God and licences by man? Will he also look again at the more important unfairness that those in rural areas, such as Kinross and West Perthshire, who do not get reception even on one channel, neverthless pay the full licence?

Mr. Rees

On the first point, which is not easy to resolve, there will be great discussion.

As regards reception in different areas, I am sure that the hon. and learned Gentleman has been on to the Department. If there is any particular point, perhaps he will let me know. There are difficulties in this respect, but some of the technical changes and reallocations of frequencies this year should deal with many of them.

Mr. Alexander W. Lyon

Is it not correct that there has to be a decision about an increase in the BBC licence revenue before January, February, March and April of next year? In those circumstances is it not right that we should consider whether the licence fee should continue or should be paid out of taxation or the revenue from the levy on ITV?

I apologise, Mr. Speaker, for braying my "Hear, hear." I apologise also to the new Cromwell of the House, my hon. Friend the Member for Rugby (Mr. Price). This seemed to be a perfectly proper way of assenting to the proposition put forward by my hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw (Mr. Ashton)—a proposition which carries a much larger measure of approval than the Home Secretary seems to think.

Mr. Rees

Whether it is donkeys or elephants, I do not follow the analogy completely. My hon. Friend is wrong about the time scale of licences. Certainly I could not leave the BBC, dependent as it is on licence money, deficient in funds, without passing new legislation.

The White Paper will be out soon. We shall have a discussion and we shall have to take the matter from there. It would be wrong to believe that there are clear views between both sides of the House about the licence fee and whether it should be paid for by taxation.

Mr. Whitelaw

Do not this afternoon's Questions make it clear to the Home Secretary that the Government's prolonged delay in producing the report and their White Paper on Annan is damaging to the future of the television industry? Is it not extremely important that they produce the White Paper as early as possible?

In view of the remarks of the Home Secretary the other day, in which he said that he was against creating further bureaucracies, may we be assured that when the report is published it will not propose another bureaucracy for the Open Broadcasting Authority?

Mr. Rees

The right hon. Gentleman can be sure that I shall not make the mistake that his Administration made when it introduced local government reform and built the biggest bureaucracy of all. The right hon. Gentleman knows that bureaucracies are not created by Labour Governments. We seem to inherit them. I shall watch the situation.

The Annan Report contains 500 pages and 174 recommendations. We shall publish a White Paper on them. We shall do better than the Opposition. They leak a document every weekend to solve the major problems of the day in two or three pages.