HC Deb 05 December 1978 vol 959 cc1212-4
10. Mr. Loyden

asked the Secretary of State for Social Services if he remains satisfied with the general level of social services as operated by local authorities.

Mr. Ennals

I shall not be satisfied with the level of provision of the social services until we can meet all demands made upon them. There is, however, a continuing, though moderate, rate of growth.

Mr. Loyden

I welcome my right hon. Friend's statement that he remains dissatisfied with the present position. However, is he aware that many local authority social services are not meeting the needs of pensioners and sick people? Does he not agree that much of this is a result of public expenditure cuts? When will we see his Department fighting for the reinstatement of those cuts in order that local authorities can meet the urgent needs of these people?

Mr. Ennals

It must be recognised—I am certain that my hon. Friend does recognise—that there is a tremendous disparity between the performance of one local authority and another. It is absolutely right that from time to time my hon. Friends should take the opportunity to point out this fact.

As to growth, if we take into consideration the joint finance money provided by health authorities, we now have a growth rate of about 4 per cent. This additional expenditure is needed partly to keep pace with demographic changes. It means that there is about a 2 per cent. real growth rate for an improvement in the service, particularly in relation to elderly people and children.

Mrs. Knight

Is the Secretary of State aware that some social services operated by local authorities are not functioning at present because of industrial disputes? Is he further aware that some hospitals are either unaware of this fact or ignoring it and discharging sick people into impossible home conditions? Will he please look into that situation and act to overcome it?

Mr. Ennals

The time at which a patient should be discharged is, of course, a matter for the hospitals themselves to consider. Of course, the performance of social service departments is a matter which should be taken into consideration. The fact that some of the social workers are taking industrial action is disturbing. I have made clear on a number of occasions how much I regret that social workers should put their clients at risk, as I believe they have done, in this way. I have urged them to find a negotiated solution through the proper channels. I think that that is the right way.

Mr. Stan Crowther

Does not my right hon. Friend agree that the inadequacy of the hospital service is one of the major causes of concern and is resulting in many people who ought to be in geriatric hospitals being in residential homes, thus placing an unreasonable burden on the social services?

Mr. Ennals

There is no doubt at all that the Health Service, including hospitals, as well as local authorities, could do much more if there were more resources. There is no question at all that the restraint upon resources has imposed a limitation on growth. That is one reason why in certain parts of the country, including that from which my hon. Friend comes, we have been able, as a result of redistribution of resources, to produce a faster rate of growth in those areas which traditionally over the years have been deprived. I am certain that that principle is absolutely right.

Mr. Penhaligon

Will the right hon. Gentleman comment on the allegation of some area health authorities that a good portion of their difficulties is caused by the totally inadequate efforts made by the local county councils to provide social services?

Mr. Ennals

This is absolutely true. We constantly seek to get joint planning between health authorities and local authorities, but in order to get an agreement one has to have a partnership which must involve active participation by both sides. That is why I said earlier that all of us have an obligation to ensure that in the areas in which we have a concern, pressure is brought to bear upon local authorities properly to fulfil their responsibilities.