HC Deb 13 December 1976 vol 922 cc949-51
9. Mr. loan Evans

asked the Secretary of State for Industry what consideration has been given to setting up a National Planning Commission to play a major rôle in the negotiation of planning agreements.

The Minister of State, Department of Industry (Mr. Alan Williams)

As was set out in our White Paper "The Regeneration of British Industry ", the planning agreement system is being operated through the existing departmental machinery.

Mr. Evans

Has my hon. Friend seen the interesting proposals set out in the Labour Party's document on this subject? Does he not agree that there is a need for planning powers in the Treasury and economic Departments to be brought together in an organisation of this kind, because so far there has not been a great deal of progress on planning agreements?

Mr. Williams

I appreciate the motive behind my hon. Friend's suggestion. We still feel that the best line of approach is via the sponsoring Department, which, by co-ordinating functions, can draw on the expertise of other Government Departments. We have noted suggestions in the document mentioned by my hon. Friend, and my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Industry and I have recently met the CBI and discussed with its representatives the future of planning agreements.

Mr. Grylls

Will the hon. Gentleman say how many agreements have been signed to date?

Mr. Williams

None has been signed to date, as the hon. Gentleman is well aware. Two agreements are fairly near completion and we hope for their completion in the new year. The hon. Gentleman will appreciate that part of the need is to ensure that there is minimum disruption to firms' planning cycles. We want to ensure that any arrangement will inflict minimum damage on firms' operations. Therefore, in our discussions we are trying to phase in with the planning cycles of the firms concerned.

17. Mr. Madden

asked the Secretary of State for Industry when he will announce details of the first planning agreement.

Mr. Varley

Discussions are in progress and I will make an announcement as soon as possible.

Mr. Madden

Does my right hon. Friend accept that planning agreements are the best way of securing information and good co-operation from working People? Does he recognise that we have been waiting an eternity for the first planning agreement? Indeed, we were promised 13 this year. What is the reason for the reluctance of big business to reach agreement with the Department on planning agreements?

Mr. Varley

I have made it plain more than once that I am dissatisfied with the progress on planning agreements. They were described as voluntary in a Government White Paper in December 1974. For the life of me I cannot understand why business should fear planning agreements. If business men complain to me, as they do from time to time, that they do not get enough out of their investment or technology, even where it is comparable with that of their overseas competitors, I think that the best way of making progress would be through planning agreements, and I hope that progress will be made in 1977.

Mr. Peter Bottomley

Can the Secretary of State tell us whether the nationalised industries have the benefits of planning agreements, formal or informal, with the Government? If they exist, what levels of inflation or of pay increases have been used as guidance for the nationalised industries concerned in planning their agreements with the Government?

Mr. Varley

Planning agreements will be discussed with the nationalised industries—British Rail, the British Steel Corporation, the National Coal Board and British Leyland, if the last comes in the category of public-owned industry. I understand that the National Coal Board is making very good progress with its planning agreements.

Dr. Bray

Can my right hon. Friend say what he said to the CBI and what the CBI said to him when he discussed planning agreements with it recently?

Mr. Varley

I told the CBI exactly what I have told this House—that I am disappointed with the progress made so far. The CBI expressed a reluctance to enter into planning agreements. It told me that it would rather see the work of planning go ahead through the sector working parties. I hope that in further discussions that I have with the CBI I can influence it to enter meaningful discussions. If we do not get planning agreements, the Government will have to take stock of the situation and will have to lay proposals before the House to improve the situation.