HC Deb 11 February 1971 vol 811 cc806-8
Mr. Arthur Lewis

On a point of order. You will recollect, Mr. Speaker, that I have given you private notice of a matter which I feel that the House should be in the knowledge of. Can I ask you whether you are able to say when and if you will be able to make a statement upon the subject, which is within our knowledge—[Laughter.]—which I think you would like to know a bit more—[Laughter.]—which I feel that you, Mr. Speaker, would like to reveal to the House —[Laughter.] Mr. Speaker, only you and I know how serious this is—[Laughter.] I repeat that only you and I, Mr. Speaker, know how serious the matter is. For that reason, I have left it to you—[Laughter.]

An Hon. Member

It is something even his best friends will not tell him.

Mr. Arthur Lewis

—to make a statement on this, which I regard as a very important subject which I do not wish to reveal—[Laughter.] Therefore, may I ask you to give consideration now to making a statement at some time suitable to your convenience?

Mr. Speaker

In view of the way in which the hon. Member for West Ham, North (Mr. Arthur Lewis) has put his point of order, I think that it would be better if I made the statement straight away.

The matter which the hon. Gentleman raised with me was the circumstances in which I went to give evidence in a criminal proceeding at the Old Bailey recently. The reason I went was that I had already given evidence in the magistrates' court. I was bound over to give evidence at the Old Bailey. There is no privilege which prevents a Member from being called to give evidence when the House is not actually sitting. Those were the circumstances in which I gave evidence.

Mr. Lewis

I am much obliged to you for making that statement, Mr. Speaker. You will recollect that when I raised this matter with you—it is not a laughable matter; it is a serious matter—I then pointed out to you that when you went to give evidence at the magistrates' court you were Mr. Selwyn Lloyd, but subsequently you ceased to be such—[Interruption.]—this is not a laughable matter.

Mr. Speaker

Order. If the hon. Gentleman wishes to pursue this matter, it must be done in the proper way by some form of discussion on a Motion. It cannot be pursued further by means of points of order.

Mr. Lewis

Mr. Speaker, other than by tabling a Motion of criticism, can you tell me how, in the knowledge of the point which I have put to you, this matter can be raised in the House so that we can have a discussion on the general principle rather than on the particular case the knowledge of which is in your possession?

Mr. Harold Wilson

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. Surely the rules of the House are absolutely clear about this and were not so long ago asserted in the High Court. No hon. Member can be frivolously subpoenaed, and certainly not when the House is sitting. However, in this particular matter, which you reported to the House just now, Mr. Speaker, the whole House—I am sure that I speak for both sides of the House—has the fullest confidence in your ability to decide what things you should do as Speaker of the House of Commons and what things you are entitled to do in a private capacity as a citizen feeling that you have something to contribute to an important public trial.

In those circumstances, Mr. Speaker, as we have very important business, including both a statement and a very important Bill to get through all its stages, would it not be better if the whole House were to agree that we should now make progress?

The Lord President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons (Mr. William Whitelaw)

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I am sure that my right hon. and hon. Friends would wish me to associate them with the remarks which have just been made by the right hon. Gentleman the Leader of the Opposition.

Mr. Speaker

I am grateful to both right hon. Gentlemen.