§ 1. Mr. Fisherasked the Secretary of State for Social Services whether the meals supplied to hospital nurses are at standard charges and of standard quality and quantity throughout the country; and whether hot drinks of tea, coffee or milk are subject to additional charges.
§ The Secretary of State for Social Services (Mr. Richard Crossman)I have asked hospital authorities to ensure that meals are provided at the standard 2 charges and I rely on them to achieve the highest possible standards of quality and quantity. Some hospitals also provide alternative meals at charges determined locally. Beverages are subject to additional charges if not paid for as part of a basic meal, but the Whitley Council has now agreed that the cost of beverages supplied to resident nurses outside mealtimes should be regarded as covered by their existing annual lodging charge.
§ Mr. FisherThe right hon. Gentleman has, I think, acknowledged that there is a good deal of evidence that the charges and the quality and quantity of meals are not uniform throughout the country and meals are sometimes inadequate. Does he not think that the pay-as-you-eat scheme, not in principle but in practice, is often working out in a thoroughly unsatisfactory way having regard to the demanding nature of the nurses' work?
§ Mr. CrossmanI am glad that the hon. Gentleman agrees that this is something for which the nurses themselves have been asking, although it has worked out irregularly because of the variations in practice of the different areas. This is, I think, being averaged out, but there is still a good deal of dissatisfaction even in spite of that.
§ Dame Irene WardBearing in mind that a little progress has been made, will the right hon. Gentleman tell me when the next Whitley Council, which he says is to meet, will in fact meet? Further, I ask him again whether he will 3 give adequate instructions to the management side of the Whitley Council so that it may really deal with the question of nurses' pay, student nurses' pay and all the matters which are essential to the nursing profession?
§ Mr. CrossmanI am grateful to the hon. Lady for agreeing that some little advance has been made—
§ Dame Irene WardVery little.
§ Mr. Crossman—some little advance on the beverages side. On the other other side, as she knows, the position is that the staff side rejected the offer and made a claim for an increase of £1 a week for younger students, pupils and nursing auxiliaries, or, alternatively, the issue of a free meal voucher for a main meal each day. That is now being considered. My Ministry is considering it very seriously indeed, but the hon. Lady will appreciate that the idea of my simply ordering all the authorities concerned to follow a certain line would not be in accord with the Whitley Council tradition.
§ Mr. BishopThis is a most unsatisfactory "beverage report". Will my right hon. Friend take immediate action to give social justice to the nurses and avoid growing militancy?
§ Mr. CrossmanI am very anxious to get this settled, and I agree with my hon. Friend that more should be done. This is why I said that we were very seriously considering the staff side's demands.
§ Dame Irene WardWhen is the Council to meet?
§ Mr. Maurice MacmillanAre we not in danger of some confusion here about whether what is really wrong is that the charges for nurses' food are too high or the pay for nurses generally, and student nurses in particular, is too low? If the right hon. Gentleman is in such great difficulty, could he not, perhaps, ask his right hon. Friend the Secretary of of State for Education and Science to put up the price of school meals and give him something to help him out?
§ Mr. CrossmanThat is a suggestion which I am prepared to consider—coming, as it does, from that quarter.