§ 12. Mr. Lawsonasked the Secretary of State for Scotland what was the ratio of pupils to teachers in Scottish primary and secondary schools in 1938, 1958, and at the latest convenient date.
§ Mr. Buchan26.9, 24.7 and 23.3, the last figure being for 1966–67. Only full-time certificated teachers are counted.
§ Mr. LawsonAs the number of teachers per student has increased over a period—the ratio has improved in this respect—can my hon. Friend give us an understanding why there is a constant apparent failure to use the increased number of students? Why is there difficulty about student teachers when we have more teachers than ever before in relation to the number of students?
§ Mr. BuchanOne reason is the nature of the curriculum and the broadening of the syllabus.
§ Mr. GrimondCan the hon. Gentleman confirm that the postponement of the raising of the school leaving age is only for two years? Can he tell us what the teacher-child ratio will be when it is raised and that it will be no worse than it is at present?
§ Mr. BuchanThis point has been adequately dealt with in the House in the last month and the assurances the right hon. Gentleman asks for have been given.
§ Mr. MacArthurThe teacher-pupil ratio after the raising of the school leaving age is critical to the whole of this problem. Will the hon. Gentleman give an estimate of what that ratio will be and tell us what new initiatives he is taking to provide the expertise we need if the raising of the school leaving age is to be practicable?
§ Mr. BuchanAs a teacher throughout the 13 years of neglect of Scottish education before we came to power, I am conscious of the problems facing us. In 1966–67, the ratio in secondary schools was 16, so we are achieving progress. But it would be impossible to estimate what the ratio might be in future. It will depend entirely on the success of our very considerable efforts.