NEW WRIT (DUMFRIES) (Hansard, 20 November 1963)

§ Mr. Emrys Hughes (South Ayrshire)
The House should give a little further consideration to this Motion and think a little of the electors of the constituency. I have had certain opinions given to me about the date of this by-election. I represent the adjoining constituency of South Ayrshire. The Dumfries constituency is onevery like the South Ayrshire constituency. It is a very large scattered agricultural constituency containing a very large number of villages. It is not like St. Marylebone. It is a very much more difficult thing to fight an agricultural constituency than a constituency in London. I suggest that it would be advisable for the Government, after listening to the representations which I make, to postpone the Dumfries by-election until after the Christmas Recess.

§ Mr. Cyril Bence (Dunbartonshire, East)
Until after the lambing season.

§ Mr. Hughes
Several considerations have to be borne in mind. One is that the Conservative candidate has only just been adopted and is a stranger to the constituency. However much the Government may want to see the Solicitor-General for Scotland in this House, there is not such a great overwhelming anxiety on the part of the electors of Dumfries. It is quite understandable that the Government should want to see the Solicitor-General for Scotland in the House after the very long period when we have been without one here. However, if another earl had wished to resign his peerage and contest a seat for the House of Commons, I doubt very much whether the Solicitor-General would have had this chance.
But that is not the point. The point is whether great constituencies are to be bartered about at the convenience of 997 the Government machine. The situation here is that this very scattered constituency wants to see what kind of a Member it shall have. There are already four candidates in the field, and it is reasonable that the electors should have the opportunity of seeing and testing the calibre of every possible candidate. The people of Dumfries have grave doubts whether they should elect the Solicitor-General for Scotland without finding out his views on important questions of the day. Naturally, the Solicitor-General for Scotland will want to explain, for example, the housing policy of the Government in all the innumerable villages, especially those where there are no houses—[Laughter.]—no municipal houses. I use the term "municipal houses"because in many of those villages the houses which are not municipal cannot come under the designation of houses at all.
Here is a constituency where housing has been one of the biggest controversial problems in the last year. Hon. Members who attend the Scottish Grand Committee—I am quite sure that the Prime Minister will be pleased to go there, when he is called—know that the Dumfriesshire housing problem has caused great concern from Kirkconnel in the north to Lockerbie in the south. Not only will the Conservative candidate have to go to innumerable meetings, but he will have to canvass. I submit that it is in the interests of the electors and of the candidates that they should have the fullest opportunity of meeting each other.
With the very small number of village halls in the area, it is difficult to arrange for the electors to hear the different candidates. It would not be good enough for the Conservative candidate to rush in and spend three, four, or five minutes in speaking and then dash off under the assumption that he has converted the electorate. From the point of view of geography alone I believe that the people of Dumfries are entitled to know something about the candidates; they are not prepared to vote for a pig in a poke.
I cannot conceive that the Conservative candidate, although he is a very able advocate and Solicitor-General, can possibly convert between now and Christmas the very large number of 998 people who are up in arms against the increase of rents. I do not see any reason for rushing the by-election before Christmas. This is a period of the year when there is snow on the hills of Dumfriesshire and there are climatic as well as geographical difficulties. I therefore suggest that the Conservative candidate will not have time before the by-election to go round all those housing estates and appease all the people who are indignant because Dumfriesshire now has the highest municipal rents in Scotland.
I do not wish the Conservative candidate to be under a disadvantage. The other candidates are all electors in the constituency and have an advantage over him. There is far more political acumen and political judgment in Dumfriesshire than there is in Kinross. The people there are not so easily satisfied. Although the Solicitor-General for Scotland is familiar with the legal problems of Scotland, he is not known in the constituency, and the people want to see him. The Labour, Liberal and Scottish Nationalist candidates all live in Dumfries and the people are familiar with them, but they do not know anything about the Conservative candidate and they look upon him as somebody just dumped down by the Conservative headquarters in Edinburgh against the will of the local people. As I say, we do not want the Conservative candidate to be at a disadvantage. We want him to have fair play. We want the constituency to see him and him to see the constituency.
I have tried to discover the Government's point of view. Can it be argued that there is anxiety to get the Solicitor-General for Scotland into the House of Commons before Christmas because of the legal advice which he can give? It may be said that I am one who is always advocating that the Solicitor-General for Scotland should be available for questioning by the Scottish Grand Committee. But we have done without him for about three years and I cannot understand why there should be haste to bring him here when he is operating already. If the Government were anxious to get the Solicitor-General for Scotland into this House to serve the Scottish Grand Committee and the House, they could have sent him to Kinross or Marylebone.
999 I should be the last to see my neighbouring constituency without a Member because some of the aggrieved constituents of the former Member write to me. However, I am prepared to look after their interests. The House, having been in recess for a considerable time, is now meeting and will shortly rise for the Christmas Recess. Therefore, the elected Member for Dumfries cannot possibly be here much before Christmas and then the House does not sit again until 14th January.
I do not want to see this by-election delayed very long, but it would not inflict any hardship on the constituency if the Government were to say, "We will give the constituency the benefit of the doubt on this occasion and think of the electors first". In view of the arguments which I have put forward, I hope that the Leader of the House—I know that he is a very reasonable person and is open to conviction—will say that the Government will postpone this by-election so that the electors have the necessary opportunity to find out all about their candidates and what they stand for before they come ultimately to their decision.

§ The Lord Privy Seal (Mr. Selwyn Lloyd)
I have listened with close attention, as I am sure everyone has, to the entertaining and interesting speech of the hon. Member for South Ayrshire (Mr. Emrys Hughes).
The hon. Member talked about seats being bartered about. I have been 1000 equipped with one or two precedents. When Lord Williams, Mr. Tom Williams as he then was, applied for the Chiltern Hundreds on 1st March, 1948, the Writ was moved on 3rd March, 1948, two days later. When Colonel Morris, as he then was, one of the Sheffield Members, who later became Lord Morris of Kenwood, was moved up to the House of Lords by the party opposite to make a seat available to the right hon. and learned Member for Newport (Sir F. Soskice), then Solicitor-General, he was appointed to the Manor of Northstead on 20th March, 1950, and the Writ was moved on 21st March, 1950.
In this case the elevation to the House of Lords of the former Member for Dumfries was announced on 20th October, the Writ has been moved today, 20th November, and the by-election will be about 12th December. In all the circumstances, that is not an unreasonable period.

§ Mr. Emrys Hughes
Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that the two constituencies which he has quoted are industrial constituencies, not scattered agricultural constituencies?

§ Mr. Lloyd
That is why I think a longer period is quite reasonable. I should not strike a rather partisan note on this occasion, but I am very encouraged by the hon. Member's opposition to this Motion. This indication of nervousness about quick appeals to the electorate is distinctly encouraging.