§ 17. Mr. McKayasked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if he is aware that a child leaving school at 15 years of age has no claim through his parent to family allowances, National Insurance or National Assistance if he remains unemployed, and the parent is sick or unemployed, and that a child who leaves school at 16 years of age has 768 a claim to National Assistance of 37s. per week if unemployed; and, in view of these facts, if he will consult the National Assistance Board with a view to making regulations to enable them to give children who are unemployed at 15 years of age a claim to National Assistance.
§ Mrs. ThatcherNo, Sir. The needs of a child of 15, in the circumstances described in the Question, can be provided for in the assessment of any assistance allowance payable.
§ Mr. McKayI am afraid that the hon. Lady has not the right information on this matter. I have made inquiries about this myself of various National Insurance officers and they definitely tell me that a boy who leaves school at 15 cannot claim National Assistance and that, in addition, if his parents are on National Insurance benefit through sickness, injury or any other cause, he loses about 20s. National Insurance money. I understand that, in addition, if the father is on National Assistance he loses the 28s. which he used to get for the boy.
The whole point is whether this is a big question or so small that it can be overlooked. The Minister of Labour informs me that there are 32,181 concerned who are under 18 years of age, so this is a big question. If the hon. Lady allows for the 17-year olds, the 16-year olds and the 15-year olds, allocating the 15-year olds only one-third of the total, this would mean a total of 10,000 of these youngsters. These children have no place in society for the time being. The Minister should pay attention seriously to this matter and consider the advisability of giving a child of 15 some National Assistance just as the 16-year-old boy is able to get it.
§ Mrs. ThatcherI wonder if I may clear up what would appear to be one or two misunderstandings between the hon. Gentleman and myself? I agree that a child of 15 cannot claim National Assistance in his own right. The point I was trying to make, and on which I can assure the hon. Gentleman I am right, is that, if the boy's father is on National Assistance, an allowance can be paid in respect of the boy but not to the boy himself.
§ 25. Mr. Lawsonasked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if, in view of the number of unemployed young people under 16 years of age, he will introduce legislation to enable the National Assistance Board to pay these young people a weekly allowance.
§ Mrs. ThatcherNo, Sir. The minimum age for making independent application for National Assistance was fixed by Section 7(5) of the National Assistance Act, 1948, and my right hon. Friend has no proposals to amend it.
§ Mr. LawsonIf the hon. Lady's Government claim to have made so many improvements in past legislation, will not they look at this? Is it not a great anomaly that, for instance, although the parents of a child continuing at school may be in receipt of allowances in respect of that child, no allowances are payable if the child does not continue at school? Is there not a strange anomaly here which this Government, if they are really so much concerned to make improvements, should put right at once?
§ Mrs. ThatcherI think that the age of 16 is quite young enough to allow a child income in his own right, and there is nothing to warrant reducing the age to 15.