HC Deb 25 January 1962 vol 652 cc390-3
19. Mr. Nabarro

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he will make a statement on the economic and financial consequences and results of the pay-pause to date, notably in respect of balance of payments, exports' performance, and strength of sterling, oversea.

Mr. Brooke

My right hon. Friend dealt with these points in the House on 18th December and again in a speech in Birmingham last week. Beyond question the measures he took last July, of which the pay pause was only one part, have proved effective in strengthening our economic position as a whole and maintaining confidence in sterling.

Mr. Nabarro

Is my right hon. Friend aware that speeches in Birmingham are not relevant? Will he advise the Chancellor that, having regard to the widespread and malicious propaganda against the pay pause, it would now be propitious for the Government to publish simultaneously all the benefits that have flowed from the pay pause, including restraints in income, the progress towards a proper balance of payments, strength of sterling overseas and all other relevant factors, instead of dealing with the matter piecemeal in the country?

Mr. Brooke

I entirely agree with my hon. Friend that it will be desirable in due course to weigh up all the beneficial results. But we are not through the pay pause yet, and I think we should get on a little further before we announce what it has achieved.

Mr. Callaghan

Will the right hon. Gentleman tell us why he thinks that a policy which results in falling exports, a falling level of productivity, an increase in the cost output per unit in industry, and falling production is a successful policy? When will he and the Government get their financial circumstances in such order that we can go ahead and expand industry?

Mr. Brooke

Of course, long-term growth must be the object of all of us. If the hon. Gentleman has any doubts about the difference which my right hon. and learned Friend's measures, including the pay pause—which is only one of them—have made, I suggest that he studies the relative strength of sterling last July and today.

Mr. Jay

Has the right hon. Gentleman noticed that in the first four months of the pay pause industrial production fell by 4 per cent.? As that has been the main consequence of the Govern ment's policy, does he really claim that it is a success?

Mr. Brooke

I have no doubt whatever of its success. We are much better placed for a successful export drive in the near future.

24. Mr. A. J. Irvine

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to what extent it is Government policy that when the pay pause is ended priority will be given to the consideration of claims formulated and ready for submission before the pay pause but deferred in special circumstances, as exemplified by those affecting the claim of the Association of University Teachers which acceded to the request of the University Grants Committee to postpone presentation of its claim.

Mr. Brooke

The Government's policy is that increases in pay should be determined in the light not only of the circumstances of each case but also of the whole national interest—in particular, of the need to keep increases in income in due relationship to increases in national production. As regards university teachers, I cannot add to the reply I gave on 21st December.

Mr. Irvine

Does that reply mean that consideration will be given to the kind of special circumstances to which my Question refers? Will the right hon. Gentleman agree that it would be very unfair if those special circumstances were not taken into account?

Mr. Brooke

My original reply meant exactly what it said.

Mr. Callaghan

May we have some elucidation? Did the right hon. Gentleman's reply mean that the Guillebaud comparisons that determined railwaymen's pay have gone by the board and that the doctrine of comparative pay for the same work, which is applied in the Civil Service under the Priestley formula, is overthrown?

Mr. Brooke

I cannot answer all these matters on this particular Question, which is on a much narrower issue.

Mr. Callaghan

But does not the right hon. Gentleman remember his own answer, in which he told us that pay claims must be formulated and considered and decided by reference to the national interest and a number of other considerations? He did not mention those factors which I have brought out, but do they still exist?

Mr. Brooke

The hon. Gentleman's supplementary question went a great deal wider than the Question on the Order Paper.

Mr. Speaker

Mr. Harold Davies. Question No. 25.

Mr. Callaghan rose

—

Hon. Members

Order.

Mr. Speaker

We must get on. Mr. Harold Davies, Question No. 25.

Mr. Callaghan

I wish to rise on a point of order and—

Mr. Nabarro

A bogus one.

Mr. Callaghan

It is not a bogus one—and ask you, Mr. Speaker, whether, in safeguarding our rights as Members, you intend to allow Ministers to give a series of evasive answers on matters of extreme national importance.

Mr. Speaker

That does not raise a point of order for me. I hope that the House, the Front Benches not excepted, will help me to get rid of this practice of rising to points of order which are not such.