HC Deb 01 March 1955 vol 537 cc1883-6
49. Mr. Yates

asked the Prime Minister if he has considered the fourth recommendation of the Seventh Report of the Select Committee on Estimates, Session 1953–54, on the Foreign Service; and the views of Her Majesty's Government regarding the method by which effective control over Government expenditure overseas can be exercised.

The Prime Minister

The question at issue is how the control of expenditure is best exercised. The view of the Government about the constitutional impropriety of visits abroad by a Select Committee or its sub-committees was stated on 1st June last by ray right hon. Friend the Lord Privy Seal. To that I have nothing to add.

It is, of course, the case that overseas expenditure, like other Government expenditure, is the subject of various checks and inspections. The House and its Committees have an important function to perform in this connection, but Committees will no doubt usually wish to satisfy themselves that the inspection arrangements are adequate rather than themselves to conduct the inspections. For this purpose they have, of course, under their terms of reference, full powers to send for persons, papers and records.

Mr. Yates

Does the Prime Minister realise that the recommendation to which this Question refers was a recommendation that the House should be given an opportunity of deciding how these Committees should exercise effective control over Government expenditure abroad? Do I understand from the Prime Minister that the House is not to be allowed such an opportunity, as recommended by a Select Committee of the House?

The Prime Minister

That was all answered and dealt with by my right hon. Friend the Lord Privy Seal, and I have nothing to add to what he said on that subject.

Mr. Smithers

Is my right hon. Friend aware that a reading of the Report shows that it is very doubtful whether the Members of the Committee understood the matter with which they had to deal, that it misled the public and damaged the Foreign Service, and that no useful service, but quite the contrary, would be served by allowing the Committee members to go abroad?

Mr. Speaker

We cannot discuss the Report now.

Captain Waterhouse

On a point of order. A most damaging and completely unwarranted statement has been made by my hon. Friend about one of the Committees of this House. With great respect, may I ask you, Sir, whether you will not ask him to withdraw?

Mr. Speaker

I stopped the hon. Member who was asking the Question, because I thought that he was going much too wide. I do not think that we can discuss the Report of the Committee at this stage.

If the hon. Member said anything which was not true, or which was unjust, he ought to withdraw it, but in the circumstances I do not know.

Mr. Smithers

You have asked, Mr. Speaker, whether I said anything untrue or unjust. All I have said, with great respect, is that a reading of this Report makes it doubtful whether the members of the Committee: understood the matter with which they dealt, and to that statement I adhere.

Mr. Stokes

Further to that point of order. May I respectfully submit that some of us who know something about what goes on in connection with overseas expenditure entirely endorse the findings of the Select Committee?

Mr. Yates

Further to that point of order. Since that Report was issued, a further Report has been issued in reply to the Foreign Office. That later Report completely vindicated the Committee. Is it in order that an hon. Member should be allowed to cast a reflection on a Committee which has been proved right?

Mr. Speaker

I do not think that that is a point of order at all. Hon. Members frequently disagree with each other in this House, and so long as they do not say anything which is untrue about another hon. Member, or is unjust, I think that we ought to put up with frank expressions of opinion, so long as they are in order. There are bound to be different opinions about this matter, and opinions, though strong, if they are expressed in terms of order, should be allowed.

Several Hon. Members rose

——

Mr. Paget

Further to that point of order——

Mr. Speaker

There is no point of order in it at all. I have ruled that I could not hear anything in what the hon. Member said which was outside the rules of order. It may be quite wrong, it may be right. That is no business of mine.

Mr. Paget rose

——

Mr. Speaker

Does the hon. and learned Member rise on a new point of order?

Mr. Paget

Yes, Sir. When the right hon. and gallant Gentleman raised the question of order, surely he raised a matter of considerable principle, the right of this House to criticise the findings of the Reports of Select Committees. It is a fundamental right of this House as a body to criticise and say what it likes about the Reports of Committees.

Mr. Speaker

We are not discussing the Report of the Committee now. As for the rest of the hon. and learned Member's observations, he only said in more impressive language what I endeavoured to convey.