HC Deb 20 October 1952 vol 505 cc807-9
Mr. Paget

I beg to move, in page 3, line 10, to leave out "properly."

The Deputy-Chairman

I think that it might be for the convenience of the Committee if we took together this Amendment and the three following Amendments—in page 3, line 10, after "made," insert: only in respect of calves bred in the United Kingdom"; in line 10, leave out "may," and insert "shall"; and in line 11, leave out from "provide," to "for," in line 12.

Mr. Paget

The first two Amendments are clearly linked together. I feel that the first and second Amendments are Amendments which the Minister, in view of what he has said, will have no difficulty in accepting. These two Amendments substitute for the word "properly"— With a view to ensuring that payments under any scheme are properly made"— the words, "are made only in respect of calves bred in the United Kingdom." The Minister has told us that that is precisely the intention, and I feel that there can be very little difficulty in or objection to expressing that intention in the Bill.

The third Amendment is to substitute "shall" for "may." The Clause provides that the … Minister may by order provide … for the marking of calves imported or brought into the United Kingdom. We suggest that all imported calves should be marked. I think that the Minister agrees with us that all imported calves should be marked, but at present they are being marked under a Ministry of Food scheme and this power is only required should the Ministry of Food scheme come to an end. Therefore, I would not intend to move the third Amendment.

The fourth Amendment is to leave out the words in brackets … (subject to such exceptions, if any, as may be specified in the order). As I understand it, the Minister is in entire agreement with us that all imported calves ought to be marked. I would suggest, therefore, that this is an Amendment to which he will be able to agree, because there should be no exceptions to the marking of imported calves.

Major Legge-Bourke

I hope that the Minister will satisfy one doubt in my mind. We have had discussion on Clause 1 about the age of calves. It seems to me that the age, whatever stipulations are made about it, should also be borne in mind in this Clause, and I should be grateful if the Minister would say what is his intention.

Sir T. Dugdale

I accept the first two Amendments in principle, but I should be grateful if the hon. and learned Member for Northampton (Mr. Paget) would substitute "born" for "bred" in the second Amendment, for that would make it a little less ambiguous and bring it into line with Clause 1 (1, a).

Mr. Paget

I shall be pleased to move the Amendment in that form.

Amendment agreed to.

Further Amendment made: In line 10, after "made," insert: only in respect of calves born in the United Kingdom."—[Mr. Paget.]

Mr. Paget

I beg to move, in line 11, to leave out from "provide," to "for," in line 12.

Sir T. Dugdale

I am afraid that I cannot accept the Amendment. Its purpose is to deprive the Minister of the power to make exceptions to orders providing for the marking of calves imported into the United Kingdom. Hon. Members will agree that it is important for us to have a certain amount of latitude, for we may find exceptional cases in which we do not want to mark calves in this way. Bull calves coming over from the Republic of Ireland from time to time are licensed in an entirely different way, under the Improvement of Livestock (Licensing of Bulls) Act, 1931, and we should not want to mark those pedigree animals in this way for a subsidy, for there is no point in their having a subsidy if they have come over for stud purposes. There are other occasions on which valuable calves are admitted for exhibition at the Royal Show, and we should want latitude to allow them to enter without being marked for subsidy. For that reason, I hope that the hon. and learned Gentleman will not press the Amendment.

In reply to my hon. and gallant Friend the Member for the Isle of Ely (Major Legge-Bourke)—although it does not really arise on this Amendment—I have already tried to explain to the Committee that an imported calf will be classified as a calf until its first incisor tooth shows.

Mr. Paget

Again, the reason seems to me an eminently good one, and I beg to ask leave to withdraw the Amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Clause, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.