HC Deb 22 November 1951 vol 494 cc726-9

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Clause stand part of the Bill."

Mr. Hale

I want merely to mention this, because this Clause gives the definition of pneumoconiosis and refers back to Section 57 (3) of the National Insurance (Industrial Injuries) Act. That Section reads: In this section the expression pneumoconiosis means fibrosis of the lungs due to silica dust, asbestos dust or other dust, and includes the condition of the lungs known as dust-reticulation. In those circumstances it includes byssinosis.

Mr. Peake

The hon. Member still has it wrong. If he reads the Section to which he refers he will see that pneumoconiosis means "fibrosis of the lungs" due to the various dusts. In the case of byssinosis, I am assured that there is not fibrosis of the lungs.

Question put, and agreed to.

Clause ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 7 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

TITLE.

Amendment made: In line 3, after "die," to insert: or have died after the thirty-first day of December, nineteen hundred and forty-nine." —[Mr. Peake.]

Title, as amended, ordered to be the Title to the Bill.

Bill reported, with Amendments (Title amended) as amended, considered.

Motion made, and Question proposed. "That the Bill be now read the Third time."—[Mr. Peake.]

11.25 p.m.

Dr. Morgan

I shall not detain the House more than two minutes. I am very perturbed about the question of industrial diseases in general, and their diagnosis, especially with reference to pneumoconiosis. I want to ask whether the Minister will consider consulting with the Minister of Health. The question of medical diagnosis of the diseases mentioned in this Bill is very important.

Reference has been made constantly to medical boards. Who are to compose these boards? Obviously, they ought to be men who have some knowledge of the diseases with which they are to deal. I am not speaking of the men who are doing so at present, because some of them have got their experience in their postgraduate career. But will the Minister consult the Minister of Health and see whether he can do anything from the point of view of medical education in regard to the diagnosis of industrial diseases, especially—

Mr. Deputy-Speaker (Colonel Sir Charles MacAndrew)

I do not know where medical boards are mentioned in the Bill.

Dr. Morgan

The pneumoconiosis boards are mentioned. They are medical boards. I bow to your Ruling, but I submit, with great respect, that reference to the pneumoconiosis boards is a reference to boards which consist of medical members who are going to assess, and decide on, the medical diagnosis in any particular case. I hope I am right. I do not think the reference can mean anything else. The medical board must have some relation to some disease, and a pneumoconiosis board is dealing specially with individuals supposed to be suffering from an industrial lung disease of the type of pneumoconiosis mentioned in the Bill.

Will the Minister consider consulting the Minister of Health to see whether something can be done in regard to the medical education of members of the pneumoconiosis boards? I wish that the Minister would remember that there is practically no education in industrial diseases, or in diseases such as pneumoconiosis. There are 42 medical schools in Great Britain. There are only six in which there are permanent lectures on industrial diseases, and especially on these dust diseases.

I think that this is a question of great importance as regards justice to workers, who are to be decided for, or against. It is tremendously important to the men who will come before them that there should be on these boards men with some knowledge and experience of these diseases. In the matter of diagnosis, these cases are sometimes difficult to interpret. I do suggest that consultation with the Minister of Health, and with the medical schools, would lead to the constitution of these boards so that justice would be meted out.

11.27 p.m.

Mr. Peake

I feel that the previous holder of my present office would be perhaps better qualified to deal with the point about the education of the medical profession which has just been raised. I will take note of what the hon. Member for Warrington (Dr. Morgan) has said, and will have it carefully examined in my Department. I can only say that the sooner the Bill comes into operation, the better it will be for all those concerned.

11.28 p.m.

Dr. Summerskill

I should like to say a word on Third Reading. I omitted to say on Second Reading that I welcomed the appointment of the new Minister, but I will remedy that now and, at the same time, congratulate him on the expeditious way in which he has piloted the Bill through the House. The right hon. Gentleman is trying to establish a precedent in asking a member on the Opposition Front Bench to deal with these questions. If he feels he would like some advice privately in some part of his work I am only too prepared to brief him before he appears next time.

Already, the Minister's ears must be burning because many of my hon. Friends have congratulated him on introducing this new Amendment. This Bill is not comprehensive, but the Minister has promised that he will consider representations made in regard to partial cases of incapacity. I think that every hon. Member will agree that this Bill represents a milestone on that road which has been travelled by many of my hon. Friends who have worked in the pits as boys and men and who have endeavoured for many years to secure some improvement in the lot of those men who have suffered from these dread diseases of pneumoconiosis and byssinosis.

Question put, and agreed to.

Bill accordingly read the Third time, and passed.