TRINIDAD (CORPORAL PUNISHMENT)

HC Deb 13 February 1946 vol 419 cc376-8

32. Mr. Benson

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies why he has authorised the introduction of a Bill to permit flogging for various crimes into the Legislative Council of Trinidad.

Mr. George Hall

Owing to the very serious increase in crimes of violence in Trinidad in recent months, all responsible authorities represented to me in the strongest terms the need for awarding corporal punishment, by the Supreme Court only, for adults in the case of a limited number of such offences. It has been and is my policy to work for the reduction and eventual abolition of corporal punishment, but in view of the serious position in Trinidad and the most urgent representations to me over a period, I did not feel justified in rejecting the local Government's advice. This measure will be for a limited period only. In any case I have called for a report on its working after six months.

Mr. Benson

Does the right hon. Gentleman realise that what he refers to as limited crimes include attempts to commit as well as the commission? Does he realise this is a most reactionary proposal? Furthermore, does he realise that in the last Parliament with a Conservative majority we introduced and carried through the Second Reading of a Bill to abolish corporal punishment?

Mr. Hall

I am sure if my hon. Friend will see me I will convince him that, with the very large increase in the number of crimes, we had either to do this or the crimes would not only continue in the numbers in which they were but would possibly increase.

Mr. Paton

Is the Minister aware that the inter-Departmental Committee on corporal punishment condemned flogging as being no more deterrent than ordinary imprisonment, and does he not consider that that Committee had before it precisely the same report upon which he has now turned down its recommendations?

Mr. Hall

I can but say that very strong pressure was brought upon me in connection with this matter and I had to concede in the light of the information received.

Mr. McGovern

Is it the case that a large number of these crimes of violence are due to the poverty of the people, and would it not be better to remove the poverty than to inflict this punishment?

Mr. Pritt

If the right hon. Gentleman says that he was subjected to very strong pressure, was that not just the same type of reactionary pressure that was used to try to stop us abolishing capital punishment for theft?

Mr. Hall

Conditions are entirely different. As both the Executive and the Legislative Councils passed this ordinance with a very large majority, there was no alternative.

Mr. Benson

Does the right hon. Gentleman mean, when he suggests that conditions are entirely different there, that there is one form of punishment for blacks and one for whites? I beg to give notice in view of the unsatisfactory nature of these answers that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment.