HC Deb 23 January 1945 vol 407 cc621-2
17. Sir Geoffrey Mander

asked the Minister of National Insurance whether he will give an assurance that it is not the intention of the Government when introducing legislation on the subject of social insurance to interfere in any way with schemes already existing and legally binding on both parties in factories and industry at the present time.

The Minister of National Insurance (Sir William Jowitt)

The White Paper, Part I, on Social Insurance does not propose any compulsory alteration of schemes such as those referred to by my hon. Friend. As indicated in paragraphs 43 and 44 of the White Paper, the parties to private pensions schemes may wish to review their terms and it is contemplated that the legislation should include provisions designed to facilitate the making of any modifications which may be voluntarily agreed upon by the parties.

Mr. Shinwell

Is it intended to introduce any Bills on social insurance this Session?

Sir W. Jowitt

Yes, Sir.

52 and 53. Sir William Beveridge

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) whether, as the Government proposals for a death grant and for abolition of the approved society system will affect the work and livelihood of many thousands of employees of industrial life offices, he is in a position to make any statement as to the policy of the Government in regard to industrial assurance;

(2) whether, having regard to the recommendation made in November, 1942, in the Report on Social Insurance and Allied Services, for conversion of the business of industrial assurance into a public service under an Industrial Assurance Board, he is now in a position to add to this recommendation made by him in February, 1943, that the Government had too much else on hand.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Sir John Anderson)

The Government have judged it preferable to press forward with the working out of their proposals for a national insurance scheme, rather than divert their attention to proposals which were described by my hon. Friend himself as unessential to his plan, and which give rise to difficult and complicated issues.

Sir W. Beveridge

Is it not possible, for the Government to attend to more than one thing at the same time in this field of social insurance?

Sir J. Anderson

My hon. Friend surprises me very much. He seems to be belittling the scope and magnitude of the plan with which his name is associated. I can assure him that practical experience in the working out of the various major legislative measures which will be required to give effect to the whole National Insurance plan has shown that the task is even more complex than had been expected, and that the decision of the Government to which my hon. Friend refers was very wise.

Mr. Goldie

Cannot the Chancellor of the Exchequer do anything to relieve the very natural anxiety of employees of approved societies, who are doing such very good work?

Sir J. Anderson

I did, in the last Debate on the subject, give an assurance in regard to the employees of approved societies who might be displaced as the result of the large changes being made.

Mr. Molson

In spite of my right hon. Friend's answer, may we take it that it is the Government's intention to carry out that review of the general question of industrial assurance and funeral expenses which is promised in paragraph 136 of the White Paper?

Sir J. Anderson

Certainly. It is the Goverment's intention, so far as circumstances permit, to carry out everything that they have contemplated.

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