§ 25. Mr. Sorensenasked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he will revise the regulations respecting the infliction of corporal punishment in remand homes and approved schools; how many lads over 15 years of age have been punished with 12 strokes of a cane for a particular offence during the past year; for what offences that punishment has been or can be given; and whether he will increase to two the number of managers who must be consulted before punishments are given.
§ The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mr. Herbert Morrison)During the twelve months ended on the 30th September last 34 lads aged fifteen or over were punished in approved 1521 schools with 12 strokes of the cane. The regulations do not specify the offences for which this maximum penalty may be inflicted, but the offence in 25 of the 34 cases was absconding with aggravating circumstances; in 3 cases breaking, entering and stealing, and in 1 case false pretences, no court penalty having been inflicted for any of these offences. In the other 5 cases, the offence was gross insubordination in 2 cases, striking other boys in 2 cases, and indecency in 1 case. The question does not arise in respect of remand homes as the maximum penalty is 6 strokes of the cane. As regards the revision of the regulations, there is nothing which I can add to my answer to my hon. Friend on 26th October.
§ Mr. SorensenMay I take it from the right hon. Gentleman that he will look into this matter still further? Is he aware that such penalties would not be imposed on these boys if they were taken to court, and will he do something to prevent this mania for flagellation in these homes?
§ Mr. MorrisonIt is a matter for consideration. Sometimes the courts are in great difficulty to know what to do. It may well be that the penalties imposed in this way are less than those the courts would impose.
§ Mr. ThorneDoes my right hon. Friend think that the mentality of the children will be improved by the use of the cane?
§ Mr. MorrisonI do not want to go too far into the merits of this highly controversial subject. One day, in quieter times, the House might find time to discuss the theory of the cane both ways.
§ Mr. McGovernCould not the right hon. Gentleman encourage the system which is employed in the Navy, and provide the boys with a boxing ring, so that they can settle disputes?
§ Mr. MorrisonI believe that they go in for boxing in approved schools.
§ Mr. SorensenCould the right hon. Gentleman not consult specialists in these matters, especially probation officers, with a view to drawing attention to the fact that such penalties are not imposed for misdemeanours in the courts of this country? In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I will raise the matter on the Adjournment.