UNEMPLOYMENT ASSISTANCE(EMERGENCY POWERS) BILL. (Hansard, 5 September 1939)

§ Mr. David Grenfell
I suggested yesterday that I might have an assurance from the Minister in regard to the position of small business men who are not their own employers and who might in the present condition find their employment no longer available. If I could have such an assurance I know it would give much comfort to these people.

§ Mr. E. Smith
Municipalities have for many years had a rota, and when they have undertaken large capital developments their contractors have had to give an undertaking to take a certain percentage of local labour which had been unemployed for a fair time. We are reaching a situation now in which many firms will benefit from State orders, and I would like the Minister to give an undertaking that, within reason, such firms should undertake that a certain number of men who have been receiving public assistance should be taken on in order that the long spell of unemployment might be broken. I know of nothing worse than the despondency which appears upon the faces of some of those who have been unemployed for a considerable time, but no matter how badly off these people are they are better off than men in a certain country where the problems of unemployment have been solved. We are now trying to pull the whole country together, and in order that these men might play their part I am asking that their records should be considered. Instead of having the feeling that the nation has no use for their services, they should be given an opportunity by the firms who are benefiting by State orders, as is the case with the municipalities.

§ Mr. Lennox-Boyd
I can give the assurance asked from me by the hon. Member for Gower (Mr. Grenfell). As to the question just asked by the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent (Mr. E. Smith), the normal work of the exchanges will go on, 472 with greatly increased opportunity for finding employment, and I can assure the hon. Member that those long out of work will not be forgotten. There may perhaps be opportunities under future legislation to see that their claims are preferentially considered.

§ Mr. Tomlinson
I am more concerned about the instructions which the Minister will give out than about the powers which he has. My difficulty in dealing with these matters is not the power given to him under the Unemployment Assistance Act as it now stands, but the fact that those who are administering this matter tend to transfer all the cases they can to the public assistance committees. In the circumstances, when the Minister is sending out instructions, I hope that they will be definite and distinct. This legislation has proved the necessity for an extension of the classes of individuals covered by the powers possessed by the Minister, and this is no time for the public assistance committees and the Unemployment Assistance Board to scrap with each other as to which of them is responsible for relieving the distress of certain individuals. For the edification of the Committee I would say that that kind of thing has been going on for a long time and that it is not pleasant to have to attempt to settle disputes between them. The Minister's intentions may be good, but they can all be frustrated by the way in which the regulations are carried out.

§ Mr. A. Jenkins
In one sentence I wish to reinforce the statement made by my hon. Friend the Member for Stoke (Mr. E. Smith). Up to the present time, very substantial contracts have been placed, but we find a policy of excluding the men with the longer periods of unemployment and men of 55 years of age and upwards. If I rightly understood what the Parliamentary Secretary said, it was that no change would be made in the practice which has been carried on for a long time, and that the additional labour that would now accrue in consequence of so many men going into the Army would be relied on. I suggest that that is all wrong, and that there ought to be a definite undertaking by the Parliamentary Secretary that in future people carrying on these works shall employ their fair 473 share of those men who have been unemployed for a long time and who are about 50 to 55 years of age. Unfortunately, there has been a definite policy adopted by many employers of excluding that kind of men. Here is an opportunity to bring almost every person of that kind back into employment, to take him off unemployment assistance and public assistance and to give him the right to earn his living. I beg the Parliamentary Secretary to give us a little better undertaking than the one he has given. If he does so, it will be a matter of great satisfaction to the people concerned and to public assistance committees.

§ The Chairman
I do not profess to be fully acquainted with all these Bills, but I do not think the hon. Member's point is one on which that assurance could be given on this Clause.

§ Mr. E. Smith
I would point out, Sir Dennis, that this Bill is stated, in Clause 1, to be for the purpose of preventing or relieving distress. Our point is that distress can be relieved by giving these men employment. Some municipalities have been subject to a great deal of criticism because they have employed a number of these men, and it has been said that it is not a business proposition to employ them.

§ The Chairman
I quite see the hon. Member's point, but, as I said, I do not think it is one which could be dealt with under this Bill.

§ Mr. Jenkins
I hope the Parliamentary Secretary is not going to take advantage of your Ruling, Sir Dennis. The object of this Bill is to prevent or relieve distress, and that is what we are trying to do.

§ Mr. Lennox-Boyd
With your permission, Sir Dennis, I can assure the hon. Member for Stoke (Mr. E. Smith) that every effort will be made to assist those people who have suffered grievously in this way.