§ 2. Lieut.-Commander Fletcherasked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the fact that official figures of losses inflicted by the Italian air squadrons fighting for the nationalists in Spain have been published in Rome and that, therefore, these squadrons are not under the control of General Franco, he will reconsider his decision and make representations to the Italian Government concerning damage inflicted to British ships and loss of British lives due to attacks made by Italian aircraft?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, Sir. His Majesty's Government regret the presence in Spain of foreign combatants of whatever nationality, but they must continue to regard them as part of the military forces under the control of one or other of the Spanish parties, who alone can be held responsible for their actions.
§ Lieut.-Commander FletcherIn view of the fact that the head of the Italian Government is glorifying the exploits of these Italian air squadrons, is it not perfectly legitimate that we should make representations to the heads of the Italian Government about the damage which they are inflicting on British shipping?
§ Mr. ButlerAs I said in my answer, we must hold the Spanish authorities concerned responsible for the action of the forces under their command.
§ Mr. AttleeCan the hon. Gentleman tell us why we must regard intervention by a foreign State as necessarily the action of one of the parties in Spain? What is the reason for holding that view?
§ Mr. ButlerThese forces are operating under General Franco, and he is to be held responsible for them.
§ Mr. AttleeBut what authority has the hon. Gentleman for saying that? Does he know that these things are done by the orders of General Franco? He is telling us so, but what is the evidence for it? All the evidence that we have shows that it is accepted by the ruling authorities in Italy that these people are acting under their orders.
§ Mr. ButlerI can only repeat the answer which I have frequently given to the House that we must hold General Franco responsible for the action of the forces under his command.
§ Lieut.-Commander FletcherIs it not perfectly clear that the head of the Italian Government does not regard these air squadrons as being under the sole control of General Franco because of the commendation of their actions which he publishes? Is it not clear from the statements and actions of the head of the Italian Government that he does regard these Italian air squadrons as under his control, and not that of General Franco?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, I would not accept that interpretation.
§ 5. Mr. Manderasked the Prime Minister the names of the countries that were invited to co-operate in the British Government's scheme for neutral inspection and report on the air bombardment of civilians in Spain; what replies were received; and whether any communications have passed with the French Government on this matter as to representation on the body now to be appointed?
§ Mr. ButlerI would refer the hon. Member to the answer given by the Prime Minister to questions on this subject on 18th July. The French Government have been kept informed of developments in the negotiations regarding the formation of the Commission.
§ Mr. ManderHave the French Government suggested that they might cooperate with the British Government in sending representatives to the spot?
Miss RathboneIs it not rather an affront to the French Government that they should be ignored in this matter? 2172 Why not approach them and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics Government when you have invited all the Scandinavian Governments?
§ Mr. ButlerI am not aware that the French Government regard this as an affront.
§ Captain McEwenAre not the French Government better judges than the hon. Lady of what is an affront to them?
§ 13. Major-General Sir Alfred Knoxasked the Prime Minister whether he is aware that the town of Caceres was bombed by 16 warplanes belonging to the Spanish Republican Government on 14th July, resulting in the killing and wounding of women and children; and whether he will make representations in view of the fact that this town contains no military objective?
§ Mr. ButlerMy Noble Friend has not received any report on the air bombardment of Caceres. As regards the second part of the question, the Commission at present in process of formation will be prepared to proceed to the scene of any air attack at the request of either party in Spain.
§ Sir A. KnoxDoes not this prove that the so-called Government of Spain are just as keen to adopt this course of action as their opponents?
§ Mr. R. AclandIs it not a fact that the Government of Spain have tolerated months and months of aerial bombardment from the other side?
§ Mr. Noel-BakerHave not the Italian Government told us that 1,400 tons of bombs have been dropped by the Italian Air Force on the Spanish people in the last three months?
§ 14. Mr. Jaggerasked the Prime Minister whether he is aware that heavy reinforcements have been thrown into the attack on Sagunta and Valencia, including Italian artillery and tanks and many squadrons of German and Italian aeroplanes; and whether he has any information as to the date of arrival and route taken by these reinforcements?
§ Mr. ButlerI have no doubt that, in view of the heavy fighting reported to have taken place in these areas, the military commanders on both sides have made calls on their reserves both of men 2173 and munitions, but it is naturally impossible to estimate the date of the arrival of such reserves on any particular front.
§ 15. Mr. Cocksasked the Prime Minister whether, at the time of the negotiations for the Anglo-Italian Agreement, or since that date, the Italian Government have indicated what meaning they attach to the phrase relating to a settlement in Spain; and whether, either formally or informally, they have given the British Government to understand that the only settlement they would agree to would be one contingent on an insurgent victory?
§ The Prime MinisterIt is for the British Government to say what interpretation they put upon the phrase in question. The answer to the second part of the question is in the negative.
§ Mr. CocksAre we to understand that in the course of these negotiations the Italian Government have said nothing about the matter?
§ The Prime MinisterNo, Sir, we have had an interchange of views with the Italian Government on this matter, and on many others.
§ Mr. GallacherIs the Prime Minister not aware that Signor Mussolini has stated openly that he cannot get a treaty with France, because France is on the other side of the barricade, and does not that imply that we are on the same side of the barricade?
§ Sir Archibald SinclairHas it been made clear to the Italian Government that one of the essential factors is complete evacuation of Spain and Spanish territory by Italian troops?
§ The Prime MinisterI have always declined to say what would be our definition of a Spanish settlement, and I must adhere to that.
§ Sir A. SinclairI am not asking for a complete definition. I am asking whether evacuation of Spanish territory by Italian troops will be one essential factor in the settlement?
§ The Prime MinisterI have always declined to give a complete definition, and I do not think that a partial definition would be useful.
§ Mr. AttleeHas the right hon. Gentleman at any time informed Signor Mussolini what he means by a settlement of the Spanish question?
§ The Prime MinisterThe right hon. Gentleman must put that question down.
§ Sir A. KnoxWould not everybody in this country, except the Opposition, be pleased if this agreement were signed at once?
§ Mr. AttleeMight I press the right hon. hon. Gentleman for an answer, because that is the question on the Paper?
§ The Prime MinisterNo, Sir, I do not see that in the question on the Paper.
§ Mr. AttleeThe question asks whether they have indicated what meaning they attach to the phrase relating to a settlement in Spain.
§ The Prime MinisterThat refers to the Italian Government.
§ 16. Mr. Cocksasked the Prime Minister whether he can make any statement on the progress made with the plan for exchanging 100 British prisoners in the hands of the Spanish insurgents for 100 Italians captured by the Spanish Government?
§ Mr. ButlerMy Noble Friend is awaiting the views of the Spanish Government on this proposal. In the meantime the Spanish Government have offered to exchange 12 named Italians for 12 named prisoners in the hands of General Franco, 11 of whom are British.
§ Mr. ButlerAs soon as possible.