§ 8. Mr. James Griffithsasked the Prime Minister whether he has now received replies from the Spanish Government and the insurgent authorities at Salamanca to his appeal to both sides in the conflict to cease the bombing of civilian populations; what is the nature of the replies; and what further action is proposed in the matter?
§ The Prime MinisterThe hon. Member is doubtless referring to the initiative mentioned by my right hon. Friend the late Foreign Secretary in the course of the Debate in the House on 2nd February. The Spanish Government have accepted in principle the good offices of His Majesty's Government, but the Salamanca authorities have replied that, while they deeply regret the bombardment of open towns and have avoided on every occasion causing useless ravages, and while they take good note of the initiative of His Majesty's Government, they must nevertheless reserve proper freedom of action in so far as the free development of the campaign is concerned, which necessitates striking at military objectives wherever they may be found. As regards the last part of the question, I would refer to the reply given by my right hon. Friend to the right hon. and gallant Member for Newcastle-under-Lyme (Colonel Wedgwood) on 14th February, to which I have nothing to add at present.
§ Mr. GriffithsIn view of the fact that it is well known, and has never been denied, that the majority of aeroplanes which have been carrying out bombing raids have come from Majorca, and are 724 Italian, can that question not be raised in the Italian conversations?
§ The Prime MinisterI think it would be better for me, in the first instance, to pursue the inquiries and discussions which we have already undertaken.
§ Mr. A. V. AlexanderWill the bombing and close-up machine-gunning of British ships in Spanish waters be discussed?
§ Brigadier-General Sir Henry CroftIs it possible to suggest to both sides that the bombing of objectives, which cannot be described as military, should be considered? Is there not an opportunity of getting agreement to stop that?
§ The Prime MinisterThat is what we have done.
§ Colonel WedgwoodWas it on the initiative of the British Government alone, or had we the co-operation of the French Government?
§ The Prime MinisterI have referred to an answer given by my right hon. Friend the Member for Warwick and Leamington (Mr. Eden), in which he said:
His Majesty's Government have not approached the Vatican direct, but they have informed the French Government that they are now prepared to associate themselves with such initiative as the French Government may decide to take in the matter whether through the Vatican or through other channels."—[OFFICIAL REPORT, 14th February, 1938; col. 1512, Vol. 331.]
§ Mr. AlexanderMay I have a reply to my supplementary question in regard to the machine-gunning and bombing of British ships?
§ The Prime MinisterAs regards the bombing of British ships, if they are merchant ships, that would be the bombing of civilians.
§ Mr. AlexanderAre the Government taking any steps?
§ The Prime MinisterI have answered that in the reply that I have already given.
9. Mr. J. J. Davidsonasked the Prime Minister the total amount claimed by the British Government for British ships sunk by the insurgent authorities in Spain and the total amount outstanding up to date?
§ The Prime MinisterNo detailed claims of this nature have yet been presented to 725 the Salamanca authorities. His Majesty's Government have, however, reserved their right to claim full compensation when a suitable opportunity for presenting these claims arises.
Mr. DavidsonIf in the event of General Franco tabulating conditions for a loan to meet these commitments—
§ Mr. SpeakerThat does not arise on this question.
Mr. DavidsonOn a point of Order. May I ask whether you can state exactly why my supplementary question is out of order? My point was that there was the possibility of this subject—
§ Mr. SpeakerThe question deals with the amount outstanding up to date. There is no question of a loan.
Mr. DavidsonMy supplementary question was in connection with the commitments of General Franco on this question.
§ Mr. ShinwellMay I ask whether in the meantime, until the compensation claims have been considered and met, the seamen who have been affected are being compensated?
§ The Prime MinisterPerhaps the hon. Member will put that question on the Order Paper.
§ 11. Mr. Thorneasked the Prime Minister whether he can give any information about the withdrawal of foreign volunteers from Spain; and whether the Non-intervention Committee have had talks with M. Corbin, the French Ambassador, and Count Grandi, the Italian Ambassador, about the matter?
§ The Prime MinisterAs far back as 11th January last the Chairman's Sub-Committee of the Non-intervention Committee decided that the solution of those questions connected with the withdrawal of foreign volunteers from Spain, on which it had not yet been possible to reach agreement, could best be sought by informal negotiation, and it accordingly charged Lord Plymouth, its Chairman, to pursue this matter in such manner as he considered most suitable. As the hon. Member will be aware, these questions have also formed the subject of recent discussions between my right hon. Friend the late Foreign Secretary, the Italian Ambassador and myself. In the 726 light of these last discussions Lord Plymouth has resumed his conversations with the various representatives on the Sub-Committee with a view to reaching an early agreement.
Captain CazaletIs my right hon. Friend aware that a considerable number of Italian troops have already been withdrawn from General Franco's side and that no foreign troops have been withdrawn from the Government side?
§ 12. Mr. R. Aclandasked the Prime Minister whether he can give an assurance that this country will not agree to the granting of belligerent rights to the conflicting parties in Spain except in relation to the limited categories of contraband goods as proposed in the original British plan?
§ The Prime MinisterYes, Sir.
§ 13. Mr. Aclandasked the Prime Minister whether he will give an assurance that this country will not agree to the granting of belligerent rights to the conflicting parties in Spain until some system has been adopted which ensures to this country and to the world that no further supplies of arms or ammunition shall reach Spain or Spanish colonial territory from abroad?
§ The Prime MinisterAs the hon. Member was informed on 15th December, His Majesty's Government accepted the resolution passed by the Non-intervention Committee on 4th November last, which provided for the grant of belligerent rights to both parties in Spain when certain conditions had been fulfilled, including the re-establishment of a strengthened control scheme.
15. Sir Nairne Stewart Sandemanasked the Prime Minister whether he can now state the number of foreigners who are at present fighting for the Barcelona Government and the number who are on the side of General Franco?
§ The Prime MinisterI am not able to state with accuracy the number of foreign volunteers serving with either side in Spain. My hon. Friend will be aware that, under the plan at present being considered by the Non-intervention Committee, it is proposed to send Commissions to both Spanish parties with the express purpose of ascertaining the number of foreign volunteers engaged on either side.
§ Sir H. CroftIs it not a fact that there are now 14,000 prisoners of the International Brigade in General Franco's hands, and does not that indicate—
§ Mr. SpeakerThat is an entirely different matter.
16. Sir N. Stewart Sandemanasked the Prime Minister whether he can give any information as to the method by which goods entering Spain by way of the Pyrenees are examined?
§ The Prime MinisterNo, Sir. As no scheme for the observation of the land frontiers of Spain is now in force, this is entirely a matter for the French and Spanish authorities.
Sir N. Stewart SandemanIs the Prime Minister not aware of the huge quantities of guns, munitions and volunteers going from France into Catalonia? Cannot this be stopped?
§ The Prime MinisterThat is an entirely different question. The hon. Member has asked whether I can give him any information as to the methods by which goods entering Spain are examined. I have told him that I cannot, because there is no control at the frontier.
§ Mr. ThurtleIs not the position on the Franco-Spanish frontier exactly the same as the position in regard to the Portuguese frontier?
§ The Prime MinisterIt is. There is no control on either.
§ 19. Mr. G. Straussasked the Prime Minister whether he now has any information concerning the recent landing of large supplies of Italian armaments in insurgent Spain; and, particularly, whether any such armaments were landed in Cadiz on 30th January from a boat that had been accompanied by Italian warships?
§ The Prime MinisterInquiries have been made into the incidents alleged by the hon. Member, but no report has been received which confirms them.
§ Mr. StraussDid not the Government say a fortnight ago that inquiries would be made? As the Government have never admitted any knowledge of the arrival of Italian forces in Spain, will the right hon. Gentleman say whether the sources of information of the Government are deficient or whether they are consistently and deliberately misleading the House?
§ 21. Mr. Bennasked the Prime Minister whether he is aware that Dr. Negrin, Prime Minister of Spain, has stated officially that Italian aeroplanes and artillery took part in the recapture of Teruel; and whether, as this occurred on the day after the opening of Anglo-Italian conversations, he has inquired or will inquire of the Italian Government if their aeroplanes and artillery were so engaged?
§ The Prime MinisterI am aware of Dr. Negrin's statement, but I do not consider that the use of Italian arms already in Spain gives ground for special inquiries of the Italian Government. Incidentally, I would point out that Anglo-Italian conversations have not been opened.
§ Mr. BennIs it a matter of indifference to the Government if the Italians continue to intervene in Spain during the conversations?
§ The Prime MinisterThat is another question altogether. The right hon. Gentleman's question concerns the use of arms and the nature of their supply.
§ Mr. BennThat is exactly my point. I am asking whether the continued Italian intervention in Spain during the Anglo-Italian conversations is a matter of indifference to His Majesty's Government? The point of the question is that the Prime Minister will inquire whether these things are going on, because I am anxious to find out whether it is a matter of indifference to the Government.
§ Mr. SpeakerThe right hon. Gentleman has received a reply to his question.
Miss RathboneIs the Prime Minister aware that the Spanish Government allege that the recently arrived arms at Teruel were of the latest pattern, not previously seen in Spain, and therefore presumably could have recently arrived?
Captain CazaletIs it not the case that French artillery, guns, and aeroplanes were captured by General Franco at Teruel?
§ The Prime MinisterMy information is that arms from non-Spanish sources continue to be used by both sides.
§ 18. Mr. Graham Whiteasked the Prime Minister what reply to the protest against attacks on British shipping has been 729 received from General Franco; and whether it is proposed to take further action on this matter?
§ The Prime MinisterYes, Sir. As regards the sinking of the "Alcira," General Franco's administration have replied that an immediate investigation had shown that it had not been possible at the time of the attack to establish the nationality of the vessel, which had, moreover, aroused suspicions for various reasons, including the fact that she was within territorial waters and was not following the Nyon route. His Majesty's Government do not consider this reply to be satisfactory. The British Agent in Salamanca has accordingly been instructed to point out officially to the Salamanca authorities that there should have been no difficulty in establishing the nationality of the vessel; that, according to the information of His Majesty's Government, she was some 20 miles from the coast at the time of the attack; that, whether or not she was within territorial waters, His Majesty's Government must regard such an attack as entirely unjustifiable; and that there is no obligation on British shipping to follow the routes recommended in the Nyon Agreement. In these circumstances, His Majesty's Government must hold the Salamanca authorities responsible for the damages incurred. They, therefore, reserve their right to claim full compensation in due course for the sinking of the ship and the losses suffered by the crew. With regard to other incidents in the Mediterranean, the Salamanca authorities have declared that they considered the strong terms of His Majesty's Government's communication is unjustified. To this Sir R. Hodgson has been instructed to reply enumerating the recent events in justification of the measures which His Majesty's Government have taken in the Mediterranean.
§ Mr. ShinwellIn view of the language which the right hon. Gentleman has used in his answer, is it proposed to grant belligerent rights to General Franco before this matter has been cleared up?
§ The Prime MinisterI cannot say.
§ Sir H. CroftIs it not a fact that the hon. Member for Seaham (Mr. Shinwell) when in Spain declared that Mr. Eden must go?