§ 1. Mr. Rileyasked the Prime Minister, in view of the fact that in accordance with the British plan for the evacuation of foreign volunteers from Spain the Barcelona Government has evacuated such volunteers from the Government territory, whether he will continue to urge the Italian Government, which is a signatory to the British formula, to withdraw all Italian combatants from the rebel forces in Spain?
§ The Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs (Mr. Butler)His Majesty's Government attach great importance to the withdrawal of all foreign volunteers from Spain, and they will leave nothing undone which may contribute to this end.
§ Mr. RileyIn view of the fact that the Italian Government have accepted the British formula for the withdrawal of troops, why have those troops not been withdrawn by the Italian Government?
§ Mr. ButlerBecause the plan has not yet come into operation.
§ Mr. Noel-BakerWhen the hon. Member says that the Government will leave nothing undone, does he mean that they 1960 have made any representations in Rome since the Agreement was brought into force?
§ Mr. ButlerI think Rome is well aware of our views on the desirability of the withdrawal of volunteers from both sides.
§ Mr. A. V. AlexanderDo the Italian Government take any notice?
§ Mr. Noel-BakerDoes that mean that no representations have been made?
§ Mr. ButlerI should have to have notice of that question.
§ 3. Mr. Dayasked the Prime Minister the number of persons of British nationality who have been reported by the British Agent at Burgos as still being held as prisoners of war by General Franco's administration?
§ Mr. ButlerAccording to the latest figures received, which were issued on 29th October last, the number of United Kingdom nationals is 86, and of Canadian nationals 34.
§ Mr. ButlerI do not think it will be necessary to publish one, but I can probably get one for the hon. Member if he so desires. I only hope it will be possible for them to be released shortly.
§ Mr. ButlerI hope they will be released very soon.
§ Mr. George GriffithsAre the Irish Free State people included in "British"?
§ Mr. ButlerI will investigate that, and inform the hon. Gentleman.
§ 9. Mr. G. Straussasked the Prime Minister whether the British prisoners held by General Franco have now been released?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, Sir. But the British Agent at Burgos has reported that he has taken further steps to expedite the conclusion of the exchange arrangements, and that he hopes that the release of these men may shortly be expected.
§ Mr. StraussIn view of the fact that the International Brigade has been completely withdrawn from Government Spain, surely these men ought to be released without an exchange of prisoners?
§ Mr. ButlerThe two steps are not necessarily connected. In any case, we are pressing ahead rapidly with the necessary negotiations for the exchange of these prisoners.
§ Mr. StraussIs the hon. Member aware of the very bad conditions in the Franco prisons, and, consequently, the need for early release?
§ Mr. ButlerWe have had opportunities to investigate the conditions in the prisons, and we are making further inquiries on the subject.
§ Mr. H. G. WilliamsWill these men, when they come back to this country, be prosecuted, in view of the offence under the Act they have committed?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, Sir.
§ 12. Mr. Howard Grittenasked the Prime Minister whether His Majesty's Government have warned ships trading to Government Spain that they enter ports within the war zone at their own risk; and whether an explanation has been given of the reasons which prevent His Majesty's ships from entering territorial waters to protect British merchantmen?
§ Mr. ButlerDetailed warnings regarding the dangers to navigation to be encountered by ships entering Spanish Government ports are issued periodically by the Board of Trade. In addition to this, it has frequently been stated by members of the Government that ships trading with ports in the war zone must accept the risks which inevitably result from the existence of a state of war. As regards the last part of the question, the Government have always made clear their view that effective protection cannot be guaranteed within territorial waters unless this country is prepared to take an active part in the hostilities.
§ Mr. ShinwellIf, in spite of the Government's warning, British seamen continue to trade with Republican Spain, does it not show that they maintain the traditions of the Mercantile Marine, and that they are showng much more courage than the Government?
§ 17. Mr. Arthur Hendersonasked the Prime Minister whether he will give an assurance that His Majesty's Government will not accord belligerent rights to General Franco except as may be agreed by all the Governments represented on the Non-Intervention Committee?
§ 30. Miss Wilkinsonasked the Prime Minister whether he will give an assurance that it is still the intention of His Majesty's Government to refuse to grant belligerent rights to General Franco until the Italian troops have been withdrawn proportionately to those on the Republican side?
§ Mr. ButlerI have nothing to add to the reply given on 21st November to the hon. Members for Derby (Mr. Noel-Baker) and East Aberdeen (Mr. Boothby).
§ Mr. HendersonIn view of the fact that all the countries who are represented on the Non-Intervention Committee are parties to the agreement laying down the conditions under which belligerent rights may be given, should not all these countries be consulted before any modification is agreed to and put into force dealing with belligerency?
§ Mr. ButlerIn stating our view on the question we have always said that it is a matter for the Committee as a whole.
§ Mr. ShinwellCan the Prime Minister give an assurance that this question of belligerent rights will not be discussed with Signor Mussolini when the Prime, Minister visits Italy?
§ The Prime Minister (Mr. Chamberlain)No, Sir.
§ Mr. ShinwellDo I understand the right hon. Gentleman to say that it will not be discussed?
§ The Prime MinisterNo, Sir, I cannot give any assurance.
§ Mr. H. G. WilliamsMay I ask my right hon. Friend whether this or any other country has power to grant belligerent rights? Do not belligerent rights arise out of a question of fact, namely, a state of belligerency?
§ Miss WilkinsonCan we have an assurance that the question of belligerent rights in Spain is not going to be one of the counters to be given away in return for the illusory promises regarding Tunis?
§ Mr. PrittCan the Prime Minister tell us whether the agenda for discussion will be drawn up in Rome or in London?
§ Mr. A. HendersonMay I ask the Prime Minister—
§ Mr. Speaker rose.
23. Mr. J. J. Davidsonasked the Prime Minister what countries have been approached by His Majesty's Government for the purpose of taking part in a general attempt at mediation in the Spanish conflict?
§ Mr. ButlerHis Majesty's Government have at various times been in touch with the French and Italian Governments in regard to the possibility of bringing about the suspension of hostilities.
Mr. DavidsonMay I ask the hon. Gentleman whether these attempts at mediation have been delayed or held back by the desire of the Government for a General Franco victory?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, Sir.
§ Mr. LoftusWill my hon. Friend consider making representations to the Republics in South America to consider mediation?
§ Mr. ButlerIf we thought there was likely to be a successful outcome of such representations, we should certainly not eliminate such a possibility.
24. Mr. Davidsonasked the Prime Minister the total number of prisoners released by the Spanish Government since the establishment of the British Commission; and what number of such prisoners were Italian?
§ Mr. ButlerComplete figures have not been received, but reports show that since the end of August 147 Spanish refugees in the Cuban Embassy at Madrid and 97 Italian prisoners have been released.
§ 25. Mr. Noel-Bakerasked the Prime Minister what information he has concerning the arrival in Spain during the last four weeks of Italian troops and war material in preparation for a new offensive against Catalonia?
§ 28. Mr. Prittasked the Prime Minister whether he can give the House any information as to the assembling of troops and material for the proposed new offensive by the rebels against the Government forces in Spain; whether any Italian troops, artillery, or aeroplanes are involved; and whether any of the reports received by him recently indicate whether 1964 any Italian troops, artillery, or aeroplanes have arrived in the territory occupied by the rebels in the last three months?
§ 29. Miss Wilkinsonasked the Prime Minister what information he has received regarding the Italian troops sent recently to Spain?
§ Mr. ButlerAs regards Italian assistance to General Franco, I have nothing to add to the reply given on 28th November to the hon. Member for North Lambeth (Mr. G. Strauss). I cannot take the responsibility of making a statement about the military dispositions of either side in Spain.
§ Mr. Noel-BakerIn view of the pledges given by the Italian Government at the time the Treaty was brought into force, will His Majesty's Government call for special reports from the 30 or more British consuls and agents in Franco Spain and other agents there as to whether new Italian material has been arriving since that Treaty was brought into force?
§ Mr. ButlerAs I say, we are always getting reports from our representatives in Spain and in other countries, but I cannot give an undertaking as to any further initiative in this matter.
§ Mr. Wedgwood BennMay I ask the Prime Minister whether he realises that the assent of this House to the coming into force of the Treaty was based on the very definite pledges which he gave to the House?
§ Mr. G. StraussIn view of the admission in the answer which the hon. Gentleman gave me on 28th November that material had been arriving from Italy during the last two months, what action are His Majesty's Government going to take?
§ Mr. ButlerThe House will realise the position in which I am placed. We do not deny that there has been a certain measure of assistance from Italian sources, but I would not like it to be thought that in personnel it has amounted to more than replacements. Certainly it does not amount to any increase in the personnel of Italian troops.
§ Sir Archibald SinclairDoes not the hon. Gentleman realise that any increase at all, whether it is very much or whether it is a little, is against the pledge which 1965 was given to this House; and are His Majesty's Government quite indifferent as to whether this pledge is kept or not?
§ Mr. ButlerNo, Sir, we are not indifferent as to whether this pledge is kept or not. We regard it as very important. The House must not accept the information I have given as meaning that there has been an increase of Italian forces in Spain.
§ Mr. BennDoes the Prime Minister realise that unwillingly he has misled the House in this matter, and what is he going to do about it?
§ The Prime MinisterNo, Sir.
§ Mr. PrittMay I ask the Prime Minister whether, in view of the fact that the hon. Gentleman has just stated that these pledges have been repeatedly broken, he really thinks that any useful purpose can be served, or that the interests of this country can possibly be assisted, by his going to Rome to hold conversations with Signor Mussolini?
§ The Prime MinisterThe hon. and learned Member has not correctly repeated the statement of my hon. Friend.
§ Mr. PrittOn a point of Order. The right hon. Gentleman is wholly misinformed. I ask the right hon. Gentleman to accept my assurance.
§ Miss WilkinsonAs my question was one of those answered en bloc, I beg to give notice that, owing to the completely unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I propose to raise the matter on the Adjournment on the first opportunity.
§ 26. Mr. Noel-Bakerasked the Prime Minister whether he will publish as a White Paper the note recently addressed by the Spanish Government to His Majesty's Government on the subject of General Franco's campaign of air bombardment of the civilian population, together with the text of His Majesty's Government's reply?
§ Mr. ButlerThe note from the Spanish Government is still being examined and no reply has yet been sent. My Noble Friend, therefore, considers it premature to take any decision about publication.
§ Mr. Noel-BakerIn view of the fact that many of these places that are being bombed have no military significance, will 1966 His Majesty's Government make an immediate protest to General Franco against such bombing?
§ Mr. ButlerAs I have said in my original answer, the Spanish Government note is being considered, and it is, therefore, premature to decide about publication.
§ Lieut.-Colonel HeneageIs it not a fact that the numbers of the killed and wounded in the bombing in Spain are much less than the numbers killed on the roads in England every year? Will the Opposition concentrate on that?