§ 8. Mr. McGOVERNasked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he is aware that in the recent free-speech case at Queen's Park, Glasgow, one of the men, when arrested, was suffering from serious heart trouble but, in spite of his condition, was put in a cell; that the police surgeon only came two and a-half hours later and found his condition dangerous; that the other five men and one woman were taken next day to the central police court and lodged in a cell with criminals of various kinds; and if he will take steps to put an end to such treatment of persons arrested for minor offences, in view of the fact that the charges against four of the persons failed?
§ Mr. SKELTONI am informed that the man to whom the hon. Member refers was lodged in the police station at 9.18 p.m. on the 26th April on a charge of obstructing the police, and that he made no complaint of heart trouble. Almost immediately thereafter friends of the accused man arrived with a doctor who was allowed to examine him. Thereupon the police surgeon was sent for, and, after examining him at 10.30 p.m., reported that, while his heart was somewhat irregular, he was fit to be detained and able to plead to any charge preferred against him. The man was liberated on bail immediately after the police surgeon's examination, his total period of detention at the police station being less 904 than one and a-half hours. As regards the third part of the question I am informed that the persons referred to were sent to the central police office for trial at the stipendiary magistrate's court on the 28th April, and that while in the central police office they were not placed along with other persons in custody. On consideration of the facts there appears to be no ground to justify any further action.
§ Mr. McGOVERNMay I, at the beginning, ask the hon. Gentleman to get further information, because his whole information is false? [Hon. MEMBERS: "Oh!"] I am not suggesting that the hon. Gentleman is stating anything untrue. It is simply the information supplied to him. Further, is he aware that I was present and was charged along with these men; that this man was in a state of collapse, lying on the seat in the police station; that Dr. Buchanan, a brother of the hon. Member for Gorbals (Mr. Buchanan), was sent for, and brought to the station; that the man was in such a serious state, that the casualty surgeon deemed it expedient that be should remain in the cell overnight; that the surgeon said that the man's condition was so serious that he would not be responsible for the man going home, because he might die on the road; is the hon. Gentleman further aware, that I, along with other people, was taken to the central police station to await our appearance before the cours and placed in a cell with prostitutes methylated spirit drinkers, and pickpockets; and that 24 people were in one cell, along with myself and the others?
§ Mr. SKELTONThere does seem to be a conflict of information here, and I would be delighted to discuss the matter with my hon. Friend.
§ Mr. McGOVERNI would like not only a discussion on the matter, but that the hon. Gentleman would have inquiry made into the statement of the facts which he has given, because it is false; and I would further suggest that if what happened in Glasgow in this case had happened in Russia there would have been a great outcry.
§ 9. Mr. McGOVERNasked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he is aware that in the recent free-speech prosecutions at Queen's Park, Glasgow, the 905 police superintendent who ordered the arrests also fixed the bail and acted as police fiscal, and the magistrate who tried the case is also a member of the local police authority; and will he set up an inquiry, with a view to changing this practice and having all such cases tried in Sheriff Courts?
§ Mr. SKELTONI am informed that the magistrate who presided in the Southern Police Court did not try the cases mentioned but remitted them to the stipendiary magistrate for trial. I am also informed that the arrests were not ordered by the superintendent who acts as assistant procurator fiscal in the police court, and that bail was fixed in accordance with statute by the officer on duty in the police station. The circumstances of this case do not appear to be such as to suggest the necessity for any such inquiry as is proposed by the hon. Member.
§ Mr. McGOVERNI am not complaining about the bail, but may I ask the hon. Gentleman if it is advisable that Superintendent Cameron, who ordered the arrest, and fixed the bail, should act as police fiscal on the following morning, and that the magistrate should be also an employer of the police; is it in the interests of justice that this should be allowed to go on; and will the hon. Gentleman not set up an inquiry with a view to ending that state of affairs, and giving justice to the people who appear in these courts?
§ Mr. SKELTONI have no information on the point, but I will make inquiries as to whether or not Superintendent Cameron was also the officer on duty who fixed bail. My information may be incomplete. With regard to the general question, I have nothing to add to what I have already said. The system on which the police courts work in Scotland, so far as I know, is in complete consonance with the statutes, and no complaints, or possibility of complaints, of injustice can arise.
§ Mr. BUCHANANIs the hon. Gentleman aware that a proper legal man, in an adjacent court, conducted a trial arising out of a much larger meeting in exactly the same place and found the accused not guilty, and that the lay magistrate found these men guilty in connection with a meeting of much smaller 906 dimensions; and, in view of these contrary decisions, does he not think it advisable that, particularly where political issues are at stake, a proper lawyer should try these cases rather than a lay man, with consequent prejudices on either side?
§ Mr. SKELTONWithout adding anything to what I have said on the point of inquiry, I may say that the two sets of facts mentioned by my hon. Friend are not inconsistent. I can imagine a person being guilty of a charge in connection with the smaller meeting, and a person being guiltless in connection with the larger meeting.
§ Mr. BUCHANANI give notice that I intend to raise this matter at the earliest opportunity on the Motion for the Adjournment.