§ 34. Mr. FREEMANasked the Postmaster-General the total amount paid by the British Government to the Peninsular and Oriental Steamship Company, Limited, and its subsidiary lines for the carriage of mails for 1930?
§ The POSTMASTER-GENERAL (Mr. Ormsby-Gore)The amount paid to the Peninsular and Oriental Steamship Company for the conveyance of mails under contract between Great Britain, India, China and Australia is £295,000 per annum. In 1930 there was also a payment of about £49,000 for extra services not covered by the contract.
§ Mr. FREEMANIn view of the large sums paid by His Majesty's Government to this company, will the right hon. Gentleman stipulate in any further contracts that no lower standard of wages shall be paid to able-bodied seamen than is paid to British workers?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREI do not quite know what to gather from the hon. Member's question. If his suggestion is that the same rates should be paid to lascars as are paid to Europeans, I do not think I can give him an affirmative answer.
§ Mr. FREEMANMy suggestion is that no lower standard than is paid to British workmen should be paid, in view of the fact that they are carrying British mails.
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREI cannot give that undertaking.
Mr. MACLEANIs it not the case that, where a Government contract is entered into, certain conditions are laid down with regard both to fair wages and to other things; and will not the right hon. Gentleman see that inquiries are made to find out whether these things are being done in the case of this company?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREI must ask the hon. Gentleman to await the reply to the next question, which deals more specifically with that point, but I want to make it quite clear that the case of mail contracts is on a slightly different footing from certain other cases.
Mr. MACLEANCan the right hon. Gentleman say where the difference lies between a contract for mails and any other contract entered into by the British Government?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREPerhaps the hon. Member will await the next answer.
§ 35. Mr. FREEMANasked the Postmaster-General whether the Fair Wage Clause operates in all contracts between His Majesty's Government and the Peninsular and Oriental Steamship Company, Limited, and its subsidiary companies; what is the number and proportion of lascars employed by them during 1930; and the average monthly wage paid to each class of sailors and firemen employed in English currency?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREIn reply to the first part of the hon. Member's question, the Fair Wages Resolution has never been considered applicable to contracts with steamship companies for the conveyance of mails, nor do I think it practicable to apply it to them. Steamship companies, like railway companies, are mainly engaged in large commercial operations, and the conveyance of mails is no more than an incidental part of the general business of transport on which their labour is employed. As regards the second part of the question, I regret that I have no information.
§ Mr. FREEMANIs it the case that the average wages paid to these lascars amount to £1 7s. 6d. per month; and will not the right hon. Gentleman consider inserting a Fair Wages Clause in all future contracts?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREI cannot give that undertaking, and I am not aware whether the figures quoted lay the hon. Member are correct or not; but I think it is very undesirable to attempt to enforce the employment of European labour in the Red Sea during the summer months.
§ Mr. SHINWELLIn view of the difficulty of applying the Fair Wages Clause to lascars, will the right hon. Gentleman consider advising the Government to insert a Clause in the conditions of contract stipulating that none but British seamen 1640 should be employed; and is he aware that there is no difficulty in employing British seamen in the Red Sea?
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREIf the hon. Gentleman had been in the Red Sea as often as I have—[Interruption.]
§ Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYIt is an insult to British seamen.
§ Commander O. LOCKER-LAMPSONCould not Mr. Gandhi look after that matter?
Mr. MACLEANI understood, Mr. Speaker, that you resumed your seat to allow me to put a supplementary question.
§ Mr. SPEAKERI did not do anything of the kind.
§ Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYIt is an insult to British seamen—[Interruption]—and nonsense.