HC Deb 29 October 1909 vol 12 cc1317-39

As amended in Committee of the whole House, further considered.

Mr. H. BOTTOMLEY

May I ask your assistance, Sir, on a point of Order? I placed upon the Paper about a week ago notice of an Amendment to omit from the preamble of the Finance Bill the words "and advice" in order that it might read, that this House, whilst formally asking the assent or consent of another Place to the Bill, did not require its advice upon the financial proposals of the country. I find that by some authority which has not been divulged to me, the Amendment has been taken off the Paper. May I ask by whose authority it has been done?

Mr. SPEAKER

I think there has been a misunderstanding with regard to this. As a matter of fact, the Preamble, if any, on the Report stage comes first, and therefore it was, technically, disposed of nearly a fortnight ago. On the other hand, I have to point out that there is no Preamble. These words which the hon. Member wishes to omit are not a "Preamble" at all. I do not know what the technical name for them is. I think it is the "enacting words." The words which the hon. Member wishes to omit are the enacting words, which have been there I do not know how long—from time immemorial, I suppose, or, at all events, for 300 years. I think the hon. Member is only the second or third Member who has wished to amend them. One of my predecessors ruled that they could not be amended; and, if they could have been amended they ought to have been amended a fortnight ago.

Mr. BOTTOMLEY

When I handed in my Amendment it was placed last upon the Paper by the authorities, who accepted my phrase "Preamble." I do not object to substituting the word "enaction"; but if as you say this House is bound by precedent of 300 years to ask the advice of another place on the Finance Bill I have nothing more to say.

Mr. SPEAKER

I will not commit myself to that. All I will commit myself to is the statement that a predecessor of mine ruled on a somewhat similar occasion that we could not alter the words: "That We the Commons have freely and voluntarily resolved to give and grant unto your Majesty the several duties hereinafter mentioned." The hon. Member then wished to omit the words "freely and voluntarily."

Mr. BOTTOMLEY

Then I take it I must not move my Amendment, but that we must ask for the advice of another place.

    cc1318-32
  1. CLAUSE 85.—(Duty on Motor Spirit.) 6,219 words
    2. cc1332-4
  2. CLAUSE 86.—(Exemptions and Allowances in Respect of the Duty on Motor Spirit.) 1,040 words
    3. cc1334-5
  3. CLAUSE 87.—(Duty on Licences for Motor Cars.) 539 words
    4. cc1336-7
  4. CLAUSE 89.—(Payments into Local Taxation Account in Respect of Liquor Licences and Provisions as to Duties on Motor Car Licences.) 665 words
    5. cc1337-8
  5. CLAUSE 91.—(Payment of Duties on Motor Spirit and Motor Car Licences to Road Improvement Account.) 384 words
    6. cc1338-9
  6. CLAUSE 92.—(Payment of Half the Proceeds of the Duties on Land Values for Benefit of Local Authorities.) 403 words
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