§ Mr. CHARLES CRAIGasked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will furnish 2009 a list showing the number of old age pensions of 1s., 2s., 3s., 4s., and 5s., respectively, which have been granted per county in Ireland?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEMy right hon. Friend finds that the number of pensions actually being paid in each county can only be ascertained by obtaining returns from pension officers, the preparation of which at the present time would involve considerable labour, and would seriously impede the more pressing work of dealing with outstanding claims.
§ Mr. CHARLES CRAIGIs the hon. Gentleman aware that in some cases, at least, in Ireland all the figures asked for, and a great many more, have already been given to the local newspapers, and is he also aware that all the figures asked for are actually in the office of the pensions officers in Ireland, and that it only requires an addressed envelope and a penny stamp to get the information?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEI am afraid the hon. Member takes a rather optimistic view.
§ Mr. T. M. HEALYDoes not the Treasury know, by the amount of money it pays away, whether it be for 1s., 2s. or 5s. pensions, the number of each of these classes of pensions?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEI can assure the hon. and learned Member there is no unreadiness or unwillingness to communicate this information, but it would entail a very considerable amount of labour, which at the present time would have the effect of postponing the consideration of future claims.
§ Mr. T. M. HEALYIs there not somebody at the Treasury to-day who knows the amount of money being paid from week to week, and who must have vouchers in the Treasury representing these claims?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEIt is quite true the amount of money paid out is accurately known by the accounting officer of the Treasury, but it is not so easy to split that large sum of money into the small amounts necessary to give the detailed accurate information required. The information required for newspapers is not necessarily, though very nearly, accurate, and what would pass in that respect would soon be challenged in this House.
Lord HUGH CECILAre the Treasury not in the habit of requiring many details as to the nature of the pensions before they send the money in a lump sum?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEOf course they do.
§ Captain CLIVEArising out of the original answer, is not the stress of work on the pension officers now nearly over?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSEI wish it was, but I am afraid it is not.
§ Mr. FLYNNCould not the hon. Gentleman suggest to the Chancellor of the Exchequer the desirability of postponing the Budget until these questions are answered?
§ Mr. CHARLES CRAIGIs it not a fact that every county council in Ireland has before it a list of the pensions paid out in the various grades—1s., 2s., 3s.—and that they could let the Chancellor of the Exchequer have the information without any labour?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSENo; if I had known that was the case I would produce the information.
§ Mr. CHARLES CRAIGWill the hon. Member make inquiries as to whether it is a fact or not, and if it is will he produce the figures?
§ Mr. HOBHOUSECertainly.