HC Deb 12 August 1909 vol 9 cc654-5
Mr. RAMSAY MACDONALD

asked the Under-Secretary for the Colonies what meaning the Government attaches to the words of European descent used in the South Africa Bill [Lords]; whether the meaning of the words was discussed with the official representatives from South Africa, and with what results?

Colonel SEELY

The term European descent has been used in various Acts of Parliament passed by the Legislatures of the South African States and in official documents used in this' country. There was a judicial decision in the Transvaal in 1905 as to the interpretation of the word "white" which was regarded as substantially identical with the term of "European descent," and administrative decisions have been given in this country, but it is not possible to state in precise terms what exact meaning will be attached to the words in the Bill, which may possibly become the subject of judicial decision. I would refer my hon. Friend to the report of W. P. Swarts, A. Swarts, and D. Appel versus the Pretoria Town Council, T.S., 1905, 621, to regulations for entry of naval cadets (Monthly Naval List for July, page 856), to Army Form E.536, and to "Regulations under which Commissions in the British Army may be obtained by Officers of Colonial Military Forces," page 15, note (e). The reply to the last part of the question is in the negative.

Mr. RAMSAY MACDONALD

May I ask whether, in the event of a judicial decision in this matter, there will be an appeal to the Privy Council?

Colonel SEELY

That is a matter of law, which is made plain, I think, in the South African Bill, but I presume that would be the case. I quoted from similar words in our own official documents, because it seems quite possible that ultimately the question might come before the Judicial Committee of the Privy Council here.

Mr. W. P. BYLES

Is a person with only one European parent entitled to claim to be of European descent?

Colonel SEELY

Everybody has two parents. This question is one of great difficulty, and I cannot say what the decision would be in such a case. It is not clear, from cases already decided, how many parents are required to establish the qualification for European descent.