§ MR. D. A. THOMAS (Merthyr Tydvil)I bog to ask the President of the Board of Education whether his attention has been called to a resolution passed, nemine contradicente, at a national convention of Welsh Liberals, held at Cardiff on 11th October last, and presided over by the President of the Board of Trade, expressing approval of the attitude of the Swansea Education Authority towards what was described in the resolution as the threatened interference of the Board of Education officials with the statutory power vested in the authority in the plain words of the Act of Parliament; whether, in view of the high legal sanction given to this resolution, he has in any way modified his attitude towards the Swansea Education Authority, and if he will furnish copies of the correspondence that has passed between the Board of Education and the local authority, in reference to the matter at issue.
§ THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD OF EDUCATION, (Mr. BIRRELL,) Bristol, NMy attention has been called to the esolution of 11th October referred to in he Question. I read it with composure, though I regretted to notice that it 826 contained a reference to an alleged "threatened interference of the…officials" of my Department, who, of course, have no responsibility of the kind suggested—this being entirely the Minister's. In reply to the second paragraph of the Question, I do not know what the hon. Member means by the words "high legal sanction given to this resolution," but to the best of my know-lodge and belief my "attitude towards the Swansea Education Authority," whether modified or otherwise, has not been due to any such influences. I had already, on 4th October, intimated to the local authority that they would not be required either to sign or to countersign the teachers' agreements; this, I understood, had been one of the main points originally in dispute, and I think some misunderstanding had existed as to the purpose or reasons for that requirement. Finding, from representations made to me recently by the town council, that certain other points were involved in the dispute of a very difficult and technical character in their legal aspect, in respect to the precise nature and extent of a local authority's obligations under the Act of 1902 as regards payments for salaries of teachers and their exercise of their control of expenditure, I further decided to withdraw the suspension of certain grants, and those grants were accordingly paid before the end of October. I propose to take the opinion of the Law Officers of the Crown as to these outstanding points. The Answer to the concluding paragraph is in the negative.
§ LORD R. CECIL (Marylebone, E.)Has the right hon. Gentleman abandoned the position he took up in his letter of 31st July, in which he pointed out that there was no reason for differentiation between voluntary school and council school teachers, and explained that the uncertainty as to teachers' salaries was very unfair to the teachers.
§ MR. BIRRELLI do not think it can be said I have abandoned any position. I do not find in my long correspondence with the authority that they took the point of differentiation. The whole question is whether the education authority ought to tell the managers of the schools beforehand what salaries they would sanction in their agreements with their teachers. There is some doubt as 827 to whether I have the power to compel a local authority to express that opinion, and on that point I am seeking advice.
§ LORD R. CECILAm I not right in saying that managers of voluntary schools have repeatedly pressed the question of the differentiation of salaries?
§ MR. BIRRELLThere has been a very long correspondence between the parties in which I endeavoured to do my best between them. No doubt the question of differentiation has got to be determined some time or other.
Further asked when the local authority withdrew their ultimatum, Mr. Birrell said he had not the date in mind.