§ Order for the House to be again put into Committee read.
§ MR. T. P. O'CONNORsaid that before any hon. Member objected he should like to make a statement. The hon. Member for Loughboro had asked him to put in a proviso excluding perforated music from the operation of the Bill, and he had consented to do so. He had also consented that if the House would give him that stage that night to give further consideration to any suggested Amendments.
§ Considered in Committee.
§ (In the Committee.)
§ Mr. CALDWELL (Lanarkshire, Mid.)in the Chair.
§ Clause 1:—
910§ THE UNDER-SECRETARY OF STATE FOR THE HOME DEPARTMENT (Mr. HERBERT SAMUEL,) Yorkshire, Clevelandmoved an Amendment standing in the name of the Home Secretary.
§
Amendment proposed—
In page 1, line 6, to leave out the word 'music' and insert the words 'copies of any musical work, or has in his possession any plates for the purpose of printing or reproducing pirated copies of any musical work'."—(Mr. Herbert Samuel.)
§ Question proposed, "That the word 'music' stand part of the clause."
§ MR. T. P. O'CONNORsaid he accepted the Amendment.
§ Question put, and negatived.
§ Question proposed, "That the words 'copies of any musical work, or has in his possession any plates for the purpose of printing or reproducing pirated copies of any musical work' be there inserted."
§ MR. LUPTON (Lincolnshire, Sleaford)thought the Bill ought to be discussed. The matter was of considerable importance, and he did not understand why it should be passed through without debate.
§ SIR FREDERICK BANBURYasked whether it was in order for an hon. Member to make a speech at this period of the evening.
§ MR. HERBERT SAMUELappealed to the hon. Member to allow the Bill to proceed. The Government were very anxious that it should pass with necessary Amendments.
§ MR. LUPTONsaid he thought the Bill was a highly discreditable one for the Government to pass.
§ MR. T. P. O'CONNORsaid the Amendment he had accepted was purely of a verbal character and the hon. Gentleman's point could be raised on the next Amendment when he would endeavour to meet him.
§ MR. LUPTONsaid he was perfectly willing to meet the hon. Gentleman and discuss the measure with him, but he had already made one or two suggestions with which the hon. Gentleman had not agreed. He was anxious to defend the rights of all, the music publisher, the composer, the public, and the agents.
§ MR. SOARES (Devonshire, Barnstaple)appealed to the hon. Member to let the Bill go through this stage.
§ MR. LUPTONsaid if the hon. Gentleman in charge of the Bill wanted him to withdraw his opposition he would meet him and discuss the matter and try and make the Bill one that would be a credit to the House.
§ MR. T. P. O'CONNORobjected most strongly to such a Question being put from the Chair.
THE DEPUTY CHAIRMANsad I was a perfectly proper Question to ask and was a question frequently asked by Mr. Speaker. If there was any objection, discussion must end.
§ MR. LUPTONstated that he did object to proceeding with the Bill, and that he had said so at the opening of his remarks and all along.
And, it being after Eleven of the clock on Tuesday evening, and objection being taken to further proceeding, the 912 Deputy-Chairman left the Chair to make his Report to the House.
§ On Mr. SPEAKER taking the Chair—
§ MR. T. P. O'CONNORsaid he wished to call attention to a question of order which I had just arisen. An hon. Member opposite was suggesting some reason why the Bill under discussion should be more care fully considered, and he (Mr. O'Connor) was prepared to answer the hon. Member I when the hon. Gentleman occupying the I Chair for the moment on his own initiative asked the hon. Member whether he objected to the progress of the Bill or not, practically putting the suggestion into the mouth of the hon. Member.
§ MR. FLAVIN (Kerry, N.)asked, before Mr. Speaker replied, whether it was in order for the Chairman to leave the Chair without progress being reported.
§ MR. SPEAKERsaid he was not a Court of Appeal from either the Chairman or Deputy Chairman of Committees. He was quite sure the Deputy-Chairman acted impartially when in the Chair. What he understood the proper practice to be was that after eleven o'clock opposed business could not be taken. The Question was, was the Bill opposed or not. If an hon. Member said he opposed, the Bill could not proceed. He believed he had been guilty himself of putting the Question, "Do you object?"
§ Committee report Progress. To sit again this day.