§ Motion made, and Question proposed!, "That a Supplementary sum, not exceeding £2,000, be granted to His Majesty, to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1904, for certain Miscellaneous Legal Expenses."
* SIR ALBERT ROLLIT Islington, S.)said the foot-note explanatory of this item was in the following terms—
The excess arises in respect of expenses incurred in connection with the arrest and extradition of Whitaker Wright, and the case of the convict Lynchehaun.He should like a little more information as to the details of this expenditure which he quite approved. He wished to know the exact amount incurred in respect of Whitaker Wright's extradition, because £2,000, merely in respect of his arrest and extradition, was in itself somewhat a large sum. He hoped, however, it was not the whole amount that the Government was going to contribute towards the costs in this matter. The state of affairs in relation to the winding up of companies and the frauds in connection with many of them had been such that it was absolutely deterrent to any private prosecutor to enter upon proceedings and so to add to losses already incurred. This remark applied to the liquidation of too many companies, and the result was, on the one hand, impunity for the offender and absolute waste, as the report of the liquidator of companies showed, of many millions of money, in a manner most detrimental to the true trade interests of the country. It was in the end advantageous to trade that occurrences of this kind should not take place without prosecution. In the debate on the Address the Attorney-General had made a statement not only of the facts from his point of view and also of the law for which everyone must have the greatest respect even when, like himself, they ventured to differ from it, but he answered what he supposed to have been some reflections upon his own honour and 899 impartiality in the treatment of this matter.
* THE CHAIRMANThis Vote is not for the prosecution of Whitaker Wright. It is limited strictly to the expenses of extradition and the hon. Member must confine himself to that.
§ * SIR ALBERT ROLLITsaid he accepted that ruling at once. He only wished to say that the statement of the hon. and learned Gentleman as to his own conduct was almost unnecessary, and everyone assented to it without a single reservation. He hoped, however, the right hon. Gentleman would feel that, justice having been vindicated, there was some reason for the course that was taken, and that there was a moral and a legal obligation on the State to do more towards payment of the costs of the prosecution than was implied in this Estimate. This was justified by the result of the trial, which he and others had anticipated, and their action had thus been justified.
§ THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL (Sir ROBERT FINLAY,) Inverness Burghsthanked his hon. friend for his frank and friendly words. The total cost of the proceedings for the extradition of Lynchehaun was £1,014, and there was a further claim which was estimated at £300. In the case of Whitaker Wright the total cost was £1,150. Extradition proceedings in America, as his hon. friend was aware, were for various reasons expensive. The amount in this Estimate rid not represent what the Government had undertaken to pay in connection with the Whitaker Wright prosecution. These costs would be put on the law charges, which would be brought before the House in the ordinary way.
§ MR. SWIFT MACNEILLsaid he ought to move to reduce the Vote by £1,147, the whole of the costs incurred in the Whitaker Wright extradition. The ground of his objection was that Whitaker Wright ought not to have been allowed to escape from this country after the decision of three Judges. He himself thought that Whitaker Wright was likely to escape, and on 11th March he asked a Question—of course, contrary 900 to propriety, because nearly all pertinent Questions in this House were said to be contrary to propriety. His Question was—
I beg to ask the Home Secretary what steps, if any, are being taken by the authorities to prevent any attempt to escape from criminal justice by Mr. Whitaker Wright.And the Home Secretary replied—The hon. Member has given me no notice of that Question; he had better put it on the Paper.Before he had time to put it on the Paper Whitaker Wright escaped, and was intended to escape. He believed that if Whitaker Wright had been a poor man it would not have been necessary to spend £1,100 to secure his extradition; he would have been instantly arrested. He maintained that the circumstances under which Whitaker Wright was allowed to escape looked as if there was one law for the poor and another for the rich. He moved the reduction of the Vote by £100.
§ Motion made, and Question put, "That a sum, not exceeding £1,900, be granted for the said Service."—(Mr. Swift MacNeill.)
§ MR. LABOUCHEREsaid that Whitaker Wright having escaped, it was desirable that the extradition should take place, and that he should be brought back here for trial. What he complained of was that the man was allowed to escape from the country at all. The Law Courts had undoubtedly held that Whitaker Wright had committed a very grave offence for which he ought to be punished, and he ought, therefore, to have been kept under some sort of police surveillance until the Attorney-General issued his warrant for the arrest. Under the circumstances he would vote for the Amendment of his hon. friend.
§ MR. SOARES (Devonshire, Barnstaple)thought that the Attorney - General ought to reply. It seemed to him that one of two courses ought to be taken—either that the Attorney-General should acknowledge that he had committed a mistake in this matter, or that there should be an Appropriation-in-aid for this amount out of the right hon. and learned Gentleman's salary.
§ SIR ROBERT FINLAYsaid he would not be in order in going into the matter beyond the statement he had made the other day in the debate on the Address. The Government took every step in their power, and the extradition proceedings were successful. He had heard no suggestion that there was any remissness on the part of the Home Office, or of anyone connected with the administration of justice in connection with the escape of Whitaker Wright; and he felt sure that the hon. and learned Member was not serious in suggesting that the Home Office had connived at his escape. He
§ submitted that the expenses were properly incurred.
§ MR. SWIFT MACNEILLsaid he would not go so far as to say that the Home Office connived at Whitaker Wright's escape, but they neglected their duty. He still held to the opinion that if Whitaker Wright had not been a highly placed gentleman he would not have bean allowed to escape.
§ Question put.
§ The Committee divided:—Ayes, 126; Noes, 214. (Division List No. 16).
903| AYES. | ||
| Abraham, William (Cork, N. E.) | Foster. Sir Walter (Derby Co.) | Pirie, Duncan V. |
| Ainsworth, John Stirling | Gilhooly, James | Power, Patrick Joseph |
| Allen, Charles P. | Goddard, Daniel Ford | Price, Robert John |
| Ashton, Thomas Gair | Grant, Corrie | Reddy, M. |
| Barry, E. (Cork. S.) | Griffith, Ellis J. | Redmond, John E. (Waterford) |
| Bayley, Thomas (Derbyshire) | Harmsworth, R. Leicester | Redmond, William (Clare) |
| Beaumont, Went worth C. B. | Hayden, John Patrick | Roberts, John Bryn (Eifion) |
| Bell, Richard | Hayter, Rt. Hon. Sir Arthur D. | Roberts, John H. (Denbighs.) |
| Blake, Edward | Humphreys-Owen, Arthur C. | Roche, John |
| Boland, John | Hutchinson, Dr. Charles Fredk. | Runciman, Walter |
| Brand, Hon. Arthur G. | Johnson, John (Gateshead) | Samuel, Herbert L. (Cleveland) |
| Brigg, John | Jones, William (Carnarvonshire) | Schwann, Charles E. |
| Broadhurst, Henry | Joyce, Michael | Shackleton, David James |
| Brunner, Sir John Tomlinson | Kearley, Hudson E. | Sheehan, Daniel Daniel |
| Buchanan, Thomas Ryburn | Kilbride, Denis | Sheehy, David |
| Burke, E. Haviland | Lambert, George | Sinclair, John (Forfarshire) |
| Caldwell, James | Law, Hugh Alex. (Donegal, W.) | Slack, John Bamford |
| Cameron, Robert | Leigh, Sir Joseph | Smith, Samuel (Flint) |
| Campbell, John (Armagh, S.) | Leng, Sir John | Soares, Ernest J. |
| Campbell-Bannerman, Sir H. | Levy, Maurice | Spencer, Rt. Hn. C. R (Northants |
| Carvill, Patrick Geo. Hamilton | Lloyd-George, David | Sullivan, Donal |
| Causton, Richard Knight | Logan, John William | Taylor, Theodore C. (Radcliffe) |
| Cohen, Benjamin Louis | Lundon, W. | Tennant, Harold John |
| Condon, Thomas Joseph | MacVeagh, Jeremiah | Thomas, Sir A. (Glamorgan, E. |
| Crean, Eugene | M'Arthur, William (Cornwall) | Thomas, D. Alfred (Merthyr) |
| Crombie, John William | M'Hugh, Patrick A. | Tomkinson, James |
| Davies, Alfred (Carmarthen) | M'Kean, John | Toulmin, George |
| Delany, William | Mansfield, Horace Rendall | Trevelyan, Charles Philips |
| Devlin, Chas. Ramsay (Galway) | Mitchell, Edw. (Fermanagh, N. | Wallace, Robert |
| Devlin, Joseph (Kilkenny, N.) | Mooney, John J. | Warner, Thomas Courtenay T. |
| Dewar, John A. (Inverness-sh.) | Murphy, John | Wason, Eugene (Clackmannan) |
| Dilke, Rt. Hon. Sir Charles | Nannetti, Joseph P. | Wason, Jn. Cathcart (Orkney) |
| Donelan, Captain A. | Nolan, Joseph (Louth, South) | White, George (Norfolk) |
| Doogan, P. C. | Norton, Capt. Cecil William | White, Luke (York, E. R.) |
| Duncan, J. Hastings | O'Brien, Patrick (Kilkenny) | Whiteley, George (York, W.R.) |
| Ellice, Capt E. C (SAndrw's Bghs | O'Brien, P. J. (Tipperary, N.) | Whitley, J. H. (Halifax) |
| Ellis, John Edward (Notts.) | O'Connor, James (Wicklow, W. | Wilson, John (Durham, Mid.) |
| Emmott, Alfred | O'Donnell, John (Mayo, S.) | Young, Samuel |
| Esmonde, Sir Thomas | O'Donnell, T. (Kerry, W.) | |
| Farquharson, Dr. Robert | O'Dowd, John | TELLERS FOR THE AYES—Mr. Swift MacNeill and Mr. Labouchere |
| Fenwick, Charles | O'Kelly, Jas. (Roscommon, N.) | |
| Fitzmaurice, Lord Edmond | O'Mara, James | |
| Flavin, Michael Joseph | O'Shaughnessy, P. J. | |
| Flynn, James Christopher | Palmer, Sir Chas. M. (Durham) | |
| NOES. | ||
| Agg-Gardner, James Tynte | Anson, Sir Wlliam Reynell | Atkinson, Rt. Hon. John |
| Agnew, Sir Andrew Noel | Arnold-Forster, Rt. Hn. Hugh O. | Bagot, Capt. Josceline FitzRoy |
| Allhusen, Augustus Henry Eden | Arrol, Sir William | Bain, Colonel James Robert |
| Baird, John George Alexander | Greville, Hon. Ronald | O' Neill, Hon. Robert Torrens |
| Balcarres, Lord | Hall, Edward Marshall | Palmer, Walter (Salisbury) |
| Baldwin, Alfred | Halsey, Rt. Hon. Thomas F. | Peel, Hn. Wm. Robert Wellesley |
| Balfour, Rt. Hon. G. W. (Leed | Hambro, Charles Eric | Pemberton. John S. G. |
| Banbury, Sir Frederick George | Hamilton, Marq of (L'nd'nderry) | Percy, Earl |
| Bartley, Sir George C. T. | Hare, Thomas Leigh | Pilkington, Colonel Richard |
| Bathurst, Hon. Allen Benjamin | Harris, F. Leverton (Tynem'th) | Platt-Higgins. Frederick |
| Beach, Rt. Hn. Sir Mich. Hicks | Haslam, Sir Alfred S. | Plummer, Walter R. |
| Beckett, Ernest William | Haslett, Sir James Horner | Pretyman, Ernest George |
| Bhownaggree, Sir M. M. | Hatch, Ernest Frederick Geo. | Pym, C. Guy |
| Bignold, Arthur | Hay, Hon. Claude George | Ratcliff, R. F. |
| Bigwood, James | Heath, A. Howard (Hanley) | Reid, James (Greenock) |
| Blundell, Colonel Henry | Heath, James (Staffords., N. W. | Remnant, James Farquharson |
| Bond, Edward | Heaton, John Henniker | Renwick, George |
| Boulnois, Edmund | Henderson Sir A. (Stafford, W. | Ridley, Hn. M. W.(Stalybridge |
| Bowles, T. Gibson (King's Lynn | Hermon-Hodge, Sir Robert T. | Ridley, S. Forde (Bethnal Green |
| Brassey, Albert | Hickman, Sir Alfred | Rolleston, Sir John F. L. |
| Brodrick, Rt. Hon. St. John | Hogg, Lindsay | Rollit, Sir Albert Kaye |
| Bull, William James | Hope, J. F. (Sheffield, Brightside | Ropner, Colonel Sir Robert |
| Butcher, John George | Hoult, Joseph | Round, Rt. Hon. James |
| Campbell, Rt. Hn. J. A (Glasgow) | Houston, Robert Paterson | Rutherford. W. W. (Liverpool) |
| Carson, Rt. Hon. Sir Edw. H. | Hozier, Hn. James Henry Cecil | Sackville, Col. S. G. Stopford |
| Cautley, Henry Strother | Hudson, George Bickersteth | Sadler, Col. Samuel Alexander |
| Cavendish, R. E. (N. Lancs.) | Hunt, Rowland | Samuel, Sir H. S. (Limehouse) |
| Cavendish, V.C.W.(Derbyshire) | Jessel, Captain Herbert Merton | Sandys, Lt.-Col. Thos. Myles |
| Cayzer, Sir Charles William | Johnstone, Heywood (Sussex) | Scott, Sir S. (Marylebone, W.) |
| Cecil, Evelyn (Aston Manor) | Jones, D. Brynmor (Swansea) | Seton-Karr, Sir Henry |
| Cecil, Lord Hugh (Greenwich) | Kennaway, Rt. Hn. Sir John H. | Sharpe, William Edward T. |
| Chamberlain, Rt. Hn. J. A (Worc | Kenyon, Hn. Geo. T. (Denbigh) | Sinclair, Louis (Romford) |
| Chapman, Edward | Kenyon-Slaney, Col. W. (Salop | Skewes-Cox, Thomas |
| Charrington, Spencer | Kerr, John | Smith, H. C (North'mb Tyneside |
| Clare, Octavius Leigh | Kimber, Henry | Smith, James Parker (Lanarks. |
| Clive, Captain Percy A. | King, Sir Henry Seymour | Smith, Hon. W. F. D. (Strand) |
| Coates, Edward Feetham | Knowles, Sir Lees | Spear, John Ward |
| Cochrane, Hon. Thos. H. A. E. | Lauric, Lieut.-General | Stanley, Rt. Hon. Lord (Lancs. |
| Coghill, Douglas Harry | Law. Andrew Bonar, (Glasgow) | Stewart, Sir Mark J. M' Taggart |
| Colston, Chas. Edw. H. Athole | Lawrence, Sir Jos. (Monmouth) | Stock, James Henry |
| CON. Irwin Edward Bainbridge | Lawson. Jn. G. (Yorks., N. R.) | Stone, Sir Benjamin |
| Cripps, Charles Alfred | Lee, A. H. (Hants., Fareham) | Stroyan, John |
| Crossley, Rt. Hon. Sir Savile | Legge, Col. Hon. Heneage | Strutt, Hon. Charles Hedley |
| Cust, Henry John C. | Leveson-Gower, Frederick N.S. | Talbot, Lord E. (Chichester) |
| Dalkeith, Earl of | Llewellyn, Evan Henry | Talbot, Rt. Hn. J. G (Oxf'd Univ |
| Dalrymple, Sir Charles | Long, Col. Chas. W.(Evesham) | Taylor, Austin (East Toxteth) |
| Davenport, William Bromley | Long, Rt. Hon. W. (Bristol, S.) | Thomas, Abel (Carmarthen, E.) |
| Davies, M. Vaughan (Cardigan | Lucas, Col. Francis (Lowestoft) | Thorburn, Sir Walter |
| Denny, Colonel | Lucas, Reginald J. (Portsmouth | Tomlinson, Sir Wm. Edw. M. |
| Dickson, Charles Scott | Lyttelton, Rt. Hon. Alfred | Tuff, Charles |
| Dorington, Rt. Hon. Sir John E. | Macdona, John Cumming | Tufnell, Lieut.-Col. Edward |
| Douglas, Rt. Hon. A. Akers | Maconochie, A. W. | Valentia, Viscount |
| Doxford, Sir William Theodore | M'Calmont, Colonel James | Walker, Col. William Hall |
| Durning-Lawrence, Sir Edwin | M'Killop, James (Stirlingshire | Walrond, Rt. Hn. Sir William H. |
| Dyke, Rt. Hn. Sir William Hart | Malcolm, Ian | Warde, Colonel C. E. |
| Elliot, Hon. A. Ralph Douglas | Manners, Lord Cecil | Webb, Colonel William George |
| Evans, Samuel T. (Glamorgan) | Markham, Arthur Basil | Welby, Lt.-Col. A. C. E (Taunton) |
| Faber, George Denison (York) | Martin, Richard Biddulph | Welby, Sir Chas. G. E. (Notts.) |
| Fardell, Sir T. George | Maxwell, W. J. H. (Dumfriessh.) | Whiteley, H. (Ashton und.Lyne |
| Finlay, Sir Robert Bannatyne | Middlemore, Jn. Throgmorton | Wilson, A. Stanley (York, E.E. |
| Fitz Gerald, Sir Robert Penrose- | Milvain, Thomas | Wilson-Todd, Sir W. H. (Yorks |
| Fitzroy, Hn. Edward Algernon | Moon, Edward Robert Pacy | Wodehouse, Rt. Hn. E.R.(Bath |
| Flannery, Sir Fortescue | Morgan, D. J. (Walthamstow) | Wolff, Gustav Wilhelm |
| Flower, Sir Ernest | Morgan, J. Lloyd (Carmarthen) | Wortley, Rt. Hon. C. B. Stuart- |
| Forster, Henry William | Morrell, George Herbert | Wylie, Alexander |
| Fyler, John Arthur | Morrison, James Archibald | Wyndham, Rt Hon. George |
| Gardner, Ernest | Morton, Arthur H. Aylmer | Wyndham-Quin, Major W. H. |
| Garfit, William | Mount, William Arthur | Yerburgh, Robert Armstrong |
| Gibbs, Hon. A. G. H. | Mowbray, Sir Robert Gray C. | |
| Godson, Sir Augustus Fredk. | Muntz, Sir Philip A. | TELLERS FOR THE NOES—Sir Alexander Acland - Hood and Mr. Ailwyn Fellowes. |
| Gore, Hn. S. F. Ormsby-(Linc) | Murray, Rt. Hon. A. G. (Bute) | |
| Goschen, Hon. George Joachim | Newdegate, Francis A. N. | |
| Greene, W. Raymond (Cambs.) | Nicholson, William Graham |
Original Question put, and agreed to.
§ Resolutions to be reported.