§ MR. JOHN ELLIS (Nottinghamshire, Rusheliffe)I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether he can now inform the House as to the number and situation of the camps of concentration formed in Cape Colony, and how many men, women, and children are confined therein, and what have been the figures of mortality therein.
§ THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR WAR (Mr. BRODRICK, Surrey, Guildford)The places where the camps have been formed are:—Kimberley, Orange River Camp (near Hopetown), Vryburg, Warrenton, and Boer Exile Camp at Port Elizabeth. Lord Kitchener has promised me some figures by telegraph as to the numbers and mortality,
§ MR. C. P. SCOTT (Lancashire, Leigh)I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether he will state the numbers of white persons now or recently in the concentration camps in Natal and the Transvaal, Orange River, and Cape Colonies respectively; also the dietary for adults and for children in force in these several districts. I beg also to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether he can state what regulations are now in force in the various concentration camps in South Africa as to the detention of the women and children confined in them; and whether he will consider the desirability of permitting at least those women and children who have no male person with them in the camps, and who have friends or relatives in Cape Colony willing to receive them, to leave the camps and go to these friends.
§ MR. BRODRICKThe numbers are approximately as follow:—Transvaal, 37,739; Natal, 2,524; Orange River Colony, 20,374; Cape Colony, 2,490; Of these a large number are natives. The dietary of free issues consists of meat, bread or flour, meal, coffee, sugar, salt, and condensed milk. As the proportions vary somewhat in the different colonies, it is not possible to give full details in reply to a question. The supply of meat is from two to four pounds, and of bread, flour, or meal about seven pounds per week. To children under five, four tins milk and meal. The women and children have been in most instances brought into the camps because they cannot be fed at isolated stations, or because it was necessary to clear the districts in which they were living. I am communicating with Lord Kitchener respecting the release of those who may have friends willing to receive them.
§ MR. LLOYD-GEORGE (Carnarvon Boroughs)Can the right hon. Gentleman give the rate of mortality among the women and children?
§ MR. BRODRICKI have had notice or a question in the name of the hon. Member for Flint Boroughs, and I can answer it with regard to Johannesburg if he wishes to put it.
§ MR. HERBERT LEWIS (Flint Boroughs)Perhaps it will be convenient 542 if I read the question, of which I gave private notice two days ago:—Whether the right hon. Gentleman is aware that for three weeks ending the 13th May there were 80 deaths out of a total of 3,125 persons in the refugee camp on the racecourse at Johannesburg, and that 220 are reported sick in the camp; whether he can state what medical provision there is for treatment of the sick in this camp, and whether the sanitary and other arrangements for the health of the refugees in this and other camps are satisfactory; between what dates did the deaths take place of 41 men, 80 women, and 261 children in the camps in the Orange River Colony reported on the 7th May; how many deaths of men, women, and children took place in such camps before and after those dates; and what is the total number of deaths of men, women, and children respectively which have taken place in the refugee camps up to the present time.
§ MR. BRODRICKThe deaths at Johannesburg camp from the 1st to the 31st May amounted to six men, six women, and 68 children, and are accounted for by an epidemic of measles. There is an experienced medical officer in charge, assisted by a qualified matron and a large staff of nurses. The hospital is a well-suited, commodious brick building. The deaths for the first week in June were one woman and three children. There is no reason to suppose that the medical arrangements in this or other camps are unsatisfactory. As to the third and fourth paragraphs of the question I have no information. The deaths in the Transvaal camps for May were 39 men, 47 women, and 250 children. Further statistics have been promised me as to the other three colonies.
§ MR. WILLIAM REDMONDAre these persons regarded as prisoners, or are they at liberty to leave the camp if they think fit?
§ MR. BRODRICKAs I have explained, the women and children have been brought in because in most cases they required relief or they were in parts of the country which for military reasons it was necessary to clear. As to the point of their leaving, in no case will the 543 Government permit them to go, or will Lord Kitchener permit them to go, unless they have got places to go to in which they can be fed. The Government cannot undertake to feed a large body of people in isolated positions. As regards permission to quit the camp to those who have friends I am in communication with Lord Kitchener.
§ MR. LLOYD-GEORGEIn regard to these figures for the Transvaal, and in regard to the 336 deaths for May, do they cover the native as well as the white camps?
§ MR. BRODRICKMy impression is that these figures cover the whole of the camps.
§ MR. WILLIAM REDMONDAs this is a very serious matter, I wish to ask the Government whether they do not consider that it would be infinitely more humane if these women were to be kept prisoners—
§ *MR. SPEAKEROrder, order! The hon. Member cannot enter into a debate on this question.
§ MR. C. R. SCOTTWill the right hon. Gentleman state whether the figures given in reply to my question include natives as well as white persons?
§ MR. BRODRICKThe figures include a large number of natives.
§ DR. AMBROSE (Mayo, W.)Is the death-rate from measles as high for any hospital in the United Kingdom?
§ MR. WILLIAM REDMONDrising—
§ *MR. SPEAKEROrder, order! Any further questions must be given notice of. The question on the Paper has been fully answered.