HC Deb 13 April 1893 vol 11 cc185-8

Order read for resuming Adjourned Debate on Amendment proposed [23rd March] to Standing Order 165A.

And which Amendment was, In line 1, to leave out the words "Every Bill by which a Railway, Canal, or Tramroad Company is incorporated shall contain a clause to the following effect," and insert the words, "In the case of every Bill for incorporating a Railway, Canal, or Tramroad Company, or for giving any powers to an existing Railway, Canal, or Tramroad Company to which no Rates and Charges Order Confirmation Act expressly applies, the Committee on the Bill shall affix the rates and charges for merchandise traffic (including small parcels of a perishable nature conveyed by passenger train) by reference to the Rates and Charges Order Confirmation Act of some other Company, which, in the opinion of the Committee, will properly and conveniently apply; and the Committee shall, in the case of an existing company, provide that the rates and charges for merchandise traffic, and such small parcels as aforesaid so fixed, shall be in substitution for the rates and charges for similar traffic authorised to be taken by the company under their existing Acts. If the Committee shall he of opinion that no such Act as aforesaid will properly and conveniently apply they shall insert a clause to the following effect:"—(The Chairman of Ways and Means.)

And the Question, "That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Standing Order," having been negatived [23rd March.]

Question again proposed, "That those words be there inserted."

Debate resumed.

Amendment proposed to the said proposed Amendment, in line 16, after the word "If," to insert the words "in any such Bill other than a Railway Bill."— (The Chairman of Ways and Means.)

Question, "That those words be there inserted in the proposed Amendment," put, and agreed to.

Words, as amended, inserted in the Standing Order.

Standing Order 171 was read, and amended:—

In line 1, by leaving out the words'. "Municipal Corporation, Local Board Improvement Commission, or other."

In line 4, by inserting after the word "carriages," the words "subject to the following exceptions only."

In line 5, by leaving out the words "Provided that."

In line 15, by leaving out the word "therefore," and inserting the words "for the purpose."

In line 32, by leaving out the words "and determine," and inserting the words "during the continuance of such lease. (B.) Where the local authority are empowered to work any tram ways belonging to, or authorised to be constructed or acquired by them, the Committee on the Bill may, if they think fit, under the special circumstances of the case empower the local authority to enter into agreements for running powers over any tramways in connection with the tramways so worked or to be worked by them, and such running powers shall be deemed to be a purpose of 'The Public Health Act, 1875," and the expenses of the exercise of such powers shall, in the event of deficiency in the tramway account, be defrayed, out of a local rate, as defined by 'The Tramways Act, 1870.' Provided that in any such case the Committee on the Bill shall make-provision—

  1. (1.) That no such agreement shall have effect until approved by the Board of Trade.
  2. (2.) That all enactments, bye-laws, and regulations relating to the use of or the-running of carriages upon the tramways and the taking of tolls and charges, therefore, shall, so far as applicable, ex-lend and apply mutatis mutandis to, and shall be observed by the local authority, exercising such running powers;
  3. (3.) That such running powers shall in no case be exclusive, and shall cease unconditionally at the expiration of seven years from the date of the agreement;
  4. (4.) That further agreements for the exercise of such running powers may be made from time to time with the approval of the Board of Trade for any period not exceeding seven years, provided that such powers shall cease unconditionally at the expiration of the period for which the same are given;
  5. (5.) That all questions in dispute as to the construction of or arising in consequence of such agreements shall be determined by arbitration."

New Standing Order to follow Standing Order 170:— No powers of construction, acquisition, or taking on lease of tramway to be given to a local authority except under special local circumstances.

Motion made, and Question proposed, (170A). That no powers shall be given to any local authority to construct, acquire, or take on lease any tramway, or portion of tramway, beyond the limits of their district, unless such tramway or portion of tramway is in connection with the tramway belonging to, or authorised to be constructed or acquired by the local authority, and unless the Committee on the Bill shall determine that, having regard to the special local circumstances, such construction, acquisition, or taking on lease ought to be sanctioned. In every case in which the Committee shall so determine they shall insert a clause for the protection of the local authority of the district in which such tramway or portion of tramway is situate in the terms mutatis mutandis of Section 43 of "The Tramways Act, 1870" except that the period of seven years shall be substituted for the period of 21 years, and the period of three years for the period of years."—(The Chairman of Ways and Means.")

MR. HUNTER (Aberdeen, N.)

said, he would not trouble the House with any observations in regard to the Amendment he had to propose. He thought it would be sufficient if he pointed out that the insertion of the words "unless otherwise agreed with the Local Authority" could not possibly do any harm, and it might do good. He was rather surprised the words had not been inserted before.

Amendment proposed, in line 9, after the words "they shall" insert the words "unless otherwise agreed with the Local Authority."—(Mr. Hunter.)

Question proposed, "That those words be there inserted."

*THE CHAIRMAN OF COMMITTEES (Mr. MELLOR,) York, W.R., Sowerby

I am sorry I cannot accept these words for this reason: the Standing Order has been most carefully considered by all the persons concerned; it has the assent of the Local Government Board and of the Board of Trade; it was settled in consultation with the authorites of the House of Lords, and it is most desirable, in my opinion, that the Standing Orders of the two Houses should agree in this respect. This Order has been put in this form as a result of a good deal of experience, and I think it well that we should not alter it.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Main Question put, and agreed to. Resolved, That no powers shall be given to any local authority to construct, acquire, or take on lease any tramway or portion of tramway beyond the limits of their district, unless such tramway or portion of tramway is in connection with the tramway belonging to or authorised to be constructed or acquired by the local authority, and unless the Committee on the Bill shall determine that, having regard to the special local circumstances, such construction, acquisition, or taking on lease ought to be sanctioned. In every case in which the Committee shall so determine they shall insert a clause for the protection of the local authority of the district in which such tramway or portion of tramway is situate in the terms mutatis mutandis of Section 43 of "The Tramways Act, 1870," except that the period of seven years shall be substituted for the period of twenty-one years, and the period of three years for the period of seven years. Resolved, that the said Resolution be a Standing Order of this House.