HC Deb 28 February 1889 vol 333 cc599-601
MR. J. J. CLANCY (Dublin Co., N.)

I wish to ask the Chief Secretary a Question which was put to the Solicitor General for Ireland yesterday. It is whether the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant will, by removing Mr. Carew from Kilkenny Gaol to Dublin, give the hon. Gentleman facilities for consulting his legal adviser and preparing his defence?

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

It would have been more convenient to have had notice of this Question. I have seen some Report, but I must say I do not understand how it would enable Mr. Carew to prepare his defence if he be removed from Kilkenny to Kilmainham.

MR. CLANCY

Mr. Carew's solicitor resides in Naas, and I have a letter from the solicitor to say that if he leaves home at 5 o'clock in the morning to see Mr. Carew he cannot get back until 7 o'clock at night. Mr. Carew's counsel lives in Dublin, and he must leave at 10 o'clock in the morning, and he cannot get home again until 7 o'clock. To keep Mr. Carew in Kilkenny means that he is to be deprived of the oppotunity of consulting his legal advisers. My Question is, whether the Government will connive at that?

MR. SEXTON

Is it true that Mr. Carew has been put in a boarded cell and supplied with hospital diet, but that his clothes have not been restored to him?

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

I am not aware of that. I believe, but I am not sure. The right hon. Gentleman had better put a Question on the Paper; it is very inconvenient to answer without notice.

MR. CLANCY

I am sorry to have to put another question on the subject, but I do it because no time is to be lost in this matter. The action is to be tried shortly, and Mr. Carew wants all the time between the present and the trial in order to consult his legal advisers. I wish to ask whether, if the right hon. Gentleman observes that the keeping of Mr. Carew in Kilkenny Gaol will practically deprive him of consulting his legal advisers, he will pass over the prison rules, and direct Mr. Carew's removal to Kilmainham.

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

I have never yet heard it suggested that a prisoner should be removed from one prison to another in order to be near his solicitor. If, however, Mr. Carew's solicitor will lay the facts before the Prisons Board the matter will no doubt be considered.

MR. CLANCY

I am very sorry to have to interfere once more, but I beg to inform the right hon. Gentleman that the Prisons Board have already been informed of the facts, and have refused the request.

MR. J. REDMOND (Wexford, N.)

May I be permitted to put a Question to the right hon. Gentleman upon the matter, of which I can speak with some knowledge, as I happened to be professionally engaged in the case. It is perfectly impossible for Mr. Carew to have the necessary consultations with his professional advisers in the jail in which he is at present. The facts have been laid before the Prisons Board, and they have refused to remove Mr. Carew. I have therefore to ask the Chief Secretary whether in this state of facts he will take upon himself to recommend that the Prisons Board should at once order the removal of Mr. Carew to Dublin? The case is coming on at the forthcoming assizes at Belfast, and therefore the matter is one of the most extreme urgency.

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

Of course I shall be very glad to make any inquiry; but I think the hon. Gentleman and the House will feel that this is rather an extraordinary request to make. Instead of the solicitor going to the prisoner, the prisoner is to be removed from one prison to another to suit the convenience of the solicitor.

MR. J. REDMOND

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman whether his attention has been called to the remarks of the Lord Chief Justice of Ireland in a similar case heard the other day, which were to the effect that he and the members of his Court hoped that in all cases of that kind every facility possible would be given by the Prisons Board to enable prisoners to have the necessary consultations with their solicitors?

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

The hon. Gentleman may be sure that of those remarks I entirely approve.

MR. T. M. HEALY

As the right hon. Gentleman has said it is impossible to remove prisoners from one jail to another for the convenience of a particular solicitor, will he say how it is that certain prisoners have been brought from Ireland to London in the interest of the Times?

MR. A. J. BALFOUR

I am not fully aware of the facts; but I understand that that was in obedience to some mandate of a Court.