§ Colonel Trenchrose, pursuant to notice, to move for a Committee to consider what Improvements it was expedient to make in the House of Commons, and the buildings attached to it, for the purpose of rendering it more commodious, and facilitating the discharge of public business. Every one was aware, that for some time past, whenever there was a full attendance of Members, there was not sufficient accommodation for them. This large attendance, he believed, was not likely to be diminished. It was of great importance, therefore, that the building in which they met should be more commodious. At the present moment, when the capital was visited by a pestilential disease which had scourged so many parts of Europe, it might be worth while for hon. Members to consider whether their close attendance in that House might not render them more susceptible to disease. The House was aware that the subject had been already referred to a Select Committee, of which, amongst others, the hon. member for Middlesex, (Mr. Hume), now unfortunately absent, was a Member. The hon. member for Middlesex, though so great a friend to economy, was of opinion that, instead of attempting any alterations in the present House of Commons, it would be better to erect a new and magnificent House of Commons, to which the present building might be attached, as a library or lobby. The expense of such an erection had not been accurately defined; but it was only fair to the hon. member for Middlesex to state that a great proportion of the Committee concurred in his view of the subject, and accordingly agreed to three resolutions, which were subsequently reported to the House. The Committee had in their first resolution declared, that the House did not afford suffici- 334 ent accommodation to all the Members. He would not then enter into the details on which they founded that opinion, but at once observe, that the same Committee, in their second resolution, after hearing all the evidence on the subject, declared also that no alteration of the House which had been suggested, could, in their opinion, afford such additional accommodation as the health and convenience of the Members, or the despatch of public business required, and that as there appeared to them no alternative between building a new House of Commons, or allowing the House to remain in its present state, they thought they were not justified in going into any further inquiries without again recurring to the opinions and pleasure of the House. Notwithstanding this report, he (Colonel Trench) was of opinion that the House might be greatly improved by taking in the lobby. The present house was wholly unfit for its purpose, from its want of capacity, the prevalence of hot currents of air, and the narrowness of the seats: the results which would follow from his plan being adopted, would afford accommodation for an additional hundred Members. He begged therefore to move for a Select Committee to be appointed to consider the state of the buildings comprising the House of Commons and the offices connected with it, with a view to the better accommodation of the Members, and to facilitate the transaction of public business.
Mr. Warburtonexpressed his surprise that the gallant Member should have supposed that the member for Middlesex intended to favour the erection of a magnificent House of Commons. He had not been on the Committee, but he had conversed with his hon. friend on the subject, and he knew that magnificence formed no part of his plan. His plan was merely to build a larger and more commodious House, if the Members agreed that the present one was not sufficient. He (Mr. Warburton), however, objected to the proposal of the hon. member for Cambridge (Colonel Trench), which went to make an inconvenient oblong room still more inconvenient. If they wanted a plan with all the advantages of hearing and seeing, let them take one of the theatres of the London University, where every person was placed at the same distance from the President, so that by seeing every person present he had the means of preserving 335 order in the whole assembly. Every one acquainted with that House knew that, from its shape, it was impossible for the Speaker to preserve, on crowded nights, the order that was desirable. With this feeling, he, for one, would prefer the erection of a new House to the adoption of the plan of the hon. Member, which, he was confident, would be found nearly as expensive, without giving any of the requisite conveniences. With regard to the Committee, he would only say, that as the hon. Member had tried his plan before one Committee, he did not see why he was to have another for precisely the same purpose. He thought it would be infinitely better for the Members to come at once to the conclusion of whether it was fitting to have a new House or not; and if they thought that a new one should be erected, to refer the matter at once either to the Board of Works, or to an architect chosen for the purpose.
§ Sir John Wrottesleysaid, the simple question for the House to determine was, whether it would have a new building or not, as he believed every one who knew anything of architectural matters was satisfied that the alteration proposed by the hon. Member would not give satisfaction, and at the same time prove nearly as expensive as a new building. With respect to the hon. Member's Motion for a new Committee, he, for one, was inclined to object to it, as it would be, he conceived, a waste of time as well as a great expense, for they could not expect that professional men would attend as witnesses unless they were paid for it. Instead, therefore, of granting another Committee, he would recommend the House to pause, and take time to consider whether they would be content with the present building, or erect a new one.
§ Lord Althorpconfessed he laboured under some difficulty with respect to the question. He had consented to the appointment of the original Committee, but he had not held out any hopes of being able to concur in the report, if they recommended any very extensive alterations, and still less if they proposed building a new House of Commons. His opinions having undergone no change on this subject, he could not say he approved of the motion for a new Committee; but yet, as he knew that the hon. and gallant Gentleman (Colonel Trench) had taken great pains, and was very sanguine on the sub- 336 ject, and as further inquiry might be useful, he did not like to reject his motion altogether. He was not sure that, even if the Committee reported in favour of the hon. Gentleman's plan, that report would influence the House. At the same time, he did not wish to give any opinion, and begged to be considered as leaving the matter to the House, and not interfering in one way or the other.
Sir Robert Peelwished the question had been distinctly put, whether Members would submit to the inconveniences which at present existed, or resolve that a new House of Commons should be erected. Had that question been brought before the House, he did not hesitate to declare that he should vote against the proposal for building a new House. As to the minor proposal—the plan for improving the House, as stated by the hon. and gallant Gentlemen—as it had not been recommended by the last Committee to which it was submitted, he could see no advantage in submitting it to another Committee. With respect to the objection of the hon. Member to the oblong shape of the room, he was happy to hear that so much harmony prevailed in the more circular buildings of the University; but, with all the imperfections of the oblong, the real business of the country could always be transacted between the two sides; and there was, he conceived, ample space, except on one or two occasions of a Session, for all who took part in the debates. The erection of an enormous building, in which not more than half the Members would be assembled five nights out of the six, would be found a great practical inconvenience. He confessed, too, that he was attached, in some degree, to the present building, from the associations with which it was connected. It was with a feeling of pride that he sat in the same House where Chatham, and Pitt, and Fox, and Wyndham, had made their greatest and most splendid orations, and he could never consent to make that House the mere avenue, or lobby to another. The expense of building a new House would not be confined to that alone. Offices, Committee-rooms, and all other conveniences, must be built as a matter of course.
§ Colonel Trenchfelt, that, after the expression of opinion which the House had heard on this subject, he should not be justified in pressing his Motion. He had 337 all due reverence for the walls within which he spoke, but it could not be denied that the House was both inconvenient and unwholesome. He was still not without hopes that these evils would be remedied. The right hon. Gentleman in the Chair had, on a former occasion, beneficially exercised his judgment and discretion in some improvements which had been effected at comparatively inconsiderable cost, and he hoped that, by the same means, some alterations might be effected which would be found advantageous.
§ Motion withdrawn.