§ 2.54 p.m.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what part the Liberian merchant navy has played in the international struggle to save the Liberian supertanker "Amoco Cadiz"from complete destruction or in mitigating the damage threatened to French, Channel Islands and British coasts by the discharge of its cargo of oil.
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, measures to assist stranded vessels and to deal with oil spills from them are primarily matters for the owners of the vessel and the coastal State. The flag State is not generally in a position to assist if the casualty occurs elsewhere.
§ Lord HALEMy Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that this small country, with a population of about 1.5 million and with a wonderful history, is listed in Lloyd's List as owning the largest merchant navy in the world? It has a great new port at Monrovia. Up to 1946 this merchant navy included 11 of these dubiously dirigible leviathans, with delightfully African names like "Esso Japan"and "Amoco Cadiz". The owners of the "Amoco Cadiz"are based in Chicago and the leviathan is unsuitable for navigation on Lake Michigan. The whole story of these ships is based on their rapid changes of name, their rapid changes of ownership and their leasing to charter parties. In view of the danger that has been caused to interests in the Channel, is the Minister satisfied that the whole system of flags of convenience ought to be internationally approved and allowed to continue?
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, when a ship becomes a casualty off the coast of any country it is for that coastal State and not the flag State to provide the assistance or to intervene to protect its own interests. The salvage of the vessel is primarily a matter between the owner and the salvage company, but a coastal State has the right, under the 1969 International Convention, to give directions to those in charge of the stricken vessel or to take direct action itself in order to prevent or minimise any oil spillage or to mitigate its consequences. If it were one of our tankers in trouble off, say, the coast of Africa, we would not expect to wait for Her Majesty's Government to send salvage ships out there to deal with it; we would expect the coastal State affected to take the necessary action.
Lord PAGET of NORTHAMPTONMy Lords, can the noble Baroness suggest anywhere in the world or any circumstances in the world in which this flag State would be likely to be of assistance to anyone, except itself?
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, the Liberian Maritime Association is the registering agent for a great number of tankers and other vessels. My information is that it is now taking a strict line in providing that all these vessels arc sea-worthy and are staffed and manned by the right sort of crew. I think that it 455 comes ill from any other country to criticise what a recognised country and State is doing. We have our obligations as a registering nation and Lloyd's act on our behalf. As I have said, the Liberian Maritime Association is trying very hard and working very fast to put its house in order and to reach standards acceptable to countries all over the world.
§ Lord SHINWELLMy Lords, in case there is any misunderstanding, is my noble friend aware that the Liberian Government do not own the largest number of merchant ships in the world; that such ships are simply registered in that country; and that many of them are actually owned by British owners and shipowners in various parts of the world? That is not the trouble. The trouble is that in Liberia they do not exercise effective control over the selection of crews, particularly the navigating officers. I have ventured to put this matter before the House previously; but unless we have efficient, qualified navigating officers, accidents are bound to happen.
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, I accept what my noble friend has said, but I can only repeat that the Liberian registering organisation is carrying out checks of its vessels and crew. I understand that so far as possible it is its ambition to check every vessel at least once a year, which is the sort of system which we like to apply ourselves. It is not perfect, but we are doing the best we can within the international conventions.
§ Viscount MASSEREENE and FERRARDMy Lords, may I ask the noble Baroness whether I am right in thinking that if you are a British subject you cannot have a vessel registered under the Liberian flag? That was certainly the case when I had an interest in shipping. I am sure it is the law at the moment too.
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, that is something I should have to check on, but I shall certainly do so and write to the noble Viscount.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, may I ask the Minister whetherthe Law of the 456 Sea Conference now in session is considering the two matters which have been raised in this exchange: first, the responsibility for meeting the costs of these disasters; and secondly, the fact that a small nation can register so many merchant ships from so many territories?
§ Baroness STEDMANNo, my Lords; I am afraid that I cannot give my noble friend an answer to that question, but again I shall check on it.
§ Lord MACKIE of BENSHIEMy Lords, can the noble Baroness say how many of the tankers involved in incidents have been registered under flags of convenience?
§ Baroness STEDMANNo, my Lords, not without notice.
Lord MORRISMy Lords, may I ask the noble Baroness what offers of assistance by Her Majesty's Government were given to the French Government at the outset of the disaster? Furthermore, may I ask what reasons were given by the French Government for turning down the initial offers of assistance?
§ Baroness STEDMANMy Lords, so far as the latter part of the question is concerned, I am not competent to say what reasons were given by the French Government as to why they did not need our help earlier. It is a matter for the coastal State concerned to decide when and what kind of operation shall go on. The British Government made expert advice and help available to the French immediately we knew of the disaster, and before the clearing up operations were well under way we had a frigate and six tugs there which were helping to spray the water with chemicals to try to disperse the oil. We were available to provide help from the time the disaster happened, but as I tried to explain yesterday in answer to a Question, one cannot just make off-the-cuff decisions as to whether one is going to burn the oil off or what one is going to do. You have to look to see how much you can salvage, and it is for the coastal State to make such decisions.
§ The LORD PRIVY SEAL (Lord Peart)My Lords, I think we have had a good run on this Question.
§ Lord PEARTI will have a word with my noble friend if the noble Lord wishes to ask something further of her. She will gladly answer any questions. I think we have had a good run.
§ Lord PEARTNo; I think the noble Lord must accept what I have said.
§ Lord PEARTMy Lords, I hope that we shall conclude now.