§ Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House do now adjourn.—[Mrs. McGuire.]
12.29 am§ Mrs. Angela Browning (Tiverton and Honiton)rose—[Interruption.]
§ Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Sylvia Heal)Would Members please leave the Chamber quickly and quietly?
§ Mrs. BrowningThank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I introduce to the House a debate that is of great concern to many of us in the county of Devon. The headquarters of the Devon fire and rescue service is at Clyst St. George in my constituency of Tiverton and Honiton.
§ Mr. Anthony Steen (Totnes)On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. It is impossible to hear my hon. Friend, even though I am sitting close to her. Can she begin again so that we can hear what she is saying?
§ Madam Deputy SpeakerThat is a matter for the hon. Lady. I have asked Members to leave quickly and quietly, and most have left the Chamber.
§ Mrs. BrowningOn behalf of the Devon fire and rescue service, whose headquarters are at Clyst St. George in the Tiverton and Honiton constituency, I shall raise with the Minister concerns that have been felt for some time. We are in such a position that the Government must consider a problem that faces the county of Devon: the future of the fire and rescue service.
As long ago as 9 May, I tabled a written question to the Home Office in respect of the representations received from the emergency services on the cost to them of the changes to radio channels. On 10 May, I received a reply from the Minister of State, Home Office, the hon. Member for Norwich, South (Mr. Clarke):
The spectrum currently used by the police and fire services for radio communications has serious limitations and is the key reason why we arranged for the provision of new spectrum … We are achieving this by the introduction of the new Public Safety Radio Communications Service. We are doing so in accordance with an internationally agreed harmonized plan for use of Public Safety radio spectrum.Both the Association of Chief Police Officers and the Association of Police Authorities have concluded that the Public Safety Radio Communications Project (PSRCP) meets technical requirements and offers value for money at a national level.I have also received various representations from the Fire Service about future radio communications and control room requirements, including views on costs and on their participation in the PSRC Service.—[Official Report, 10 May 2000;Vol.349,c.404-05W.]It was known earlier this year that the change to the radio frequency required by the replacement scheme affected all emergency services nationally, but I want to draw particular attention to the impact on the Devon fire and rescue service.There is a national Home Office requirement to vacate existing radio frequencies used by the emergency services by 2005 at the latest. As a result, Devon fire and rescue service, along with all other fire authorities in England and Wales, will be required to replace its wide area radio scheme. The police service has a single framework 785 agreement to purchase the Airwave service, formerly PSRCS, which is supplied by Quadrant—a consortium led by BT. That framework agreement was negotiated by the Police Information Technology Organisation and was the subject of a referral by the European Commission to the European Court of Justice. I am afraid that my speech contains a lot of acronyms, so I shall spell them out.
Devon fire and rescue service currently shares radio transmission sites with Devon and Cornwall constabulary. Similar arrangements exist with a number of other fire authorities. Devon county council, and therefore the police, will move to a replacement radio scheme in December 2002. It is likely that many shared facilities will no longer be available to the fire service after that date. Devon county council police authority has given formal notice that current partners in shared radio facilities must make their own arrangements for future wide-area radio provision after that date.
I emphasise to the Minister that the service in Devon must not only have procured the new system but put it in place—not by 2005, but by the end of 2002. That means that it is required to replace its scheme much earlier than many other services in the country. It is currently under notice from the police that that is the time scale under which they are working, and we have every reason to believe that the police project is on time. Indeed, the police annual report confirms that it is.
Other pressures for change in the radio scheme include the increasing need for data to be sent to front-line fire appliances to meet health and safety requirements with regard to the provision of operation and tactical information. Those are not available under the current radio arrangements. If any existing shared sites remain available for fire service use, for a sole user the costs would be prohibitive. There is also concern that the communications industry will not be able to meet the demands of all emergency services' replacement needs in the time frame available. There is great anxiety in the Devon fire and rescue service about the possibility of procurement in such a short time.
In a "Dear Chief Fire Officer" letter dated February 1999, the Home Office set out the fire service strategy for radio replacement. The strategy did not propose or establish a single framework procurement option that PITO adopted, but the Home Office recommended local rather than national procurement, provision by the Home Office of procurement guidance, the adoption of an output as opposed to a technical specification, and collaboration between brigades. It also suggested that PSRCS (Airwave) should be considered as an option. According to current guidance, the strategy is still valid.
Since the publication of that advice, the Minister has commissioned two studies—one to look at options for the provision of fire control rooms, and the other to provide guidance on radio replacement options. Devon in particular would have been pleased if the second study could have been produced much earlier, given the short time frame within which it is now obliged to work. There are significant lead times for both tender and implementation, not least—as the Minister will know—because of public-sector regulations relating to tenders and contracts.
786 While I accept that two alternative strategies for radio replacement have been adopted by the police and the fire service, there are still a number of inequitable anomalies supported by central Government. The Minister of State, Home Office, has found that PSRCS represents an important part of the Government's commitment to ensuring that the police have access to modern communications facilities. I particularly want this Minister to focus on that tonight.
Over three years, the police will receive an extra £1.24 billion of central Government funding so that they can introduce the new system that they will use. Annual charges for PSRCP will be reduced by £50 million, obtained from the capital modernisation fund. The financial pressures on police forces will be taken into account in the overall level of resources to be provided for the police service in future years as part of the 2000 spending review. Today's announcement on local government expenditure clearly identified the on-going revenue costs of the scheme in figures relating to the police.
I make no complaint about the money that the Government have allocated-—one might almost say "ring-fenced" for the police. However, what is extraordinary is that one emergency service has been treated in that way, yet the Government do not seem to have recognised the important role that another emergency service, the fire and rescue service, plays, particularly in a county such as Devon, or the short time available.
§ Mr. SteenLet us forget all the abbreviations and technical details, which I realise my hon. Friend knows much more about than me. Is she saying two things? Will the whole of Devon be covered in even more aerials? All the high-technical aerials and the mobile phone aerials are going up like mushrooms. Now we will have a double lot of aerials: the fire station and police station aerials. At the same time, is it right that the smaller fire stations will probably have to go, which will put villages in rural areas at far greater risk?
§ Mrs. BrowningI am not sure that my hon. Friend is correct to say that there will necessarily be more masts throughout the county, but his point about where the money will come from is important. Clearly, there are huge pressures on the fire service budget and on its capital expenditure in providing for that new service in such a short time. The fire service clearly requires modern communication facilities to play its part in community safety, but by contrast with the funding support to the police, it has been allocated no additional funding.
Approximately 18 months ago, the Home Office provided individual brigades with indicative costings with regard to capital and revenue. Costs supplied by the Home Office for Devon were as follows: minimum capital costs of £1.3 million, to a maximum of £4.4 million; minimum revenue costs of £0.31 million, to a maximum of £1.02 million. More recent costings by Devon fire and rescue service anticipate capital costs of about £1.3 million and revenue costs of about £0.46 million.
If the Devon costings of £1.3 million and £0.46 million are considered a benchmark for other fire authorities, fire service radio replacement nationally is likely to cost about £75 million in capital costs and £27 million in on-going revenue costs—hence my pointing out that, in today's 787 announcement, we noticed that on-going revenue costs were allocated to the police because of their change, but there was apparently nothing for the fire service. That comes against a background of many fire authorities spending significant amounts in excess of standard spending assessment to maintain current provision of services.
The widening gap between SSA provision and what authorities are spending to maintain current service is well documented, the most recent case being outlined in the report of the Home Office's service expenditure forecasting group (fire) on 2001–02 to 2003–04. Devon will spend approximately 17.9 per cent. above SSA in 2001–02, with a projected pensions deficit of 14.3 per cent.
It is a critical period. As the Minister will be aware, the peaks and troughs in retirement of personnel show that the move could not have come at a worse time. Retirements are due to peak at the same time as the fire service is having to make the new provisions.
The increases in SSA and the basic credit approvals recently announced are welcome, but the SSA increase of 5 per cent. for 2001-02 and 4 per cent. for the following two years will not provide for the closing of the gap between the SSA and actual budget spending. Again, the basic credit approvals increases need to be viewed against the poor property profile of many fire authorities, including Devon; the increasing need to seek capital solutions in other areas of budget need—for example, information technology; and an authority's ability to make additional revenue implications of capital spend.
I hope that the Minister appreciates that this is not a case of Devon fire and rescue saying that they want more money simply because they need a new system. Even without that challenge, the service is struggling to maintain its current revenue and capital commitments. So although the announcements on SSA and basic credit approvals are welcome, they will not provide funding for radio replacement options.
In his reply, the Minister of State said that various representations had been made from the fire services. He also implied that best-value reviews and guidance in the joint control study report and the future radio replacement report would provide a way forward for the fire service. However, as Devon fire and rescue has told me, the control room study report does not address the issue of radio replacement. Although joint or shared control rooms may offer longer-term savings, they do not offer solutions to short-term funding requirements for radio replacement.
Practical implementation of a move to joint or shared control room facilities will take some years. However, radio replacement is required now. Although best-value reviews into control rooms and communications are encouraging authorities to seek collaborative solutions to radio replacement and to analyse joint or shared control room operations, they will not provide funding.
In May, the Minister of State said that the second Home Office report would provide guidance on radio replacement to help fire services. However, although some of that information is now available, it does not solve the immediate problem. On 19 July 2000, at a central fire brigades advisory council, it was made clear that pressures on fire authorities for radio replacement were not compatible with the time scales for reviewing 788 joint control rooms. That acknowledgement was recently reinforced with the Fire Brigades Union's publication of its opposition to the joint control study report.
We accept that communications are a vital aspect of providing a modern fire service that is able to contribute to community safety, and that Devon fire and rescue service, with other authorities, will have to replace its radio scheme by December 2002. Devon and Cornwall police, who provide the service with a radio facility, have given notice that the facility will have to be replaced by that date. Although options of joint or shared controls and the results of best-value reviews may produce savings in the long term, they do not help to meet the challenge initially facing Devon fire and rescue.
There is an inequity in recognising the implementation costs and continuing revenue implications for police, while making no additional funding provision for the fire service. Communications are a vital element of both services. The discrepancy is even more incongruous given the windfall that the Government have received from the sale of the frequency spectrum. The auction has raised a huge sum far exceeding what the Chancellor could ever have imagined he would receive.
The Government have encouraged fire authorities to seek collaboration and joint procurement options. I hope that the Minister is aware that the Devon fire authority has been very willing to seek such options. Indeed, it is working with Avon, Somerset and Dorset counties on reducing procurement costs and taking advantage of economies of scale.
I am, however, very concerned that, even as recently as the beginning of this month, on 9 November, in a letter to the hon. Member for Exeter (Mr. Bradshaw)—the letter is now in the public domain, and I have given notice to the hon. Gentleman that I would be mentioning it—the Minister himself seemed to demonstrate that he was not aware of the time constraints facing the Devon fire and rescue service. Quite clearly, he seemed to be under the impression—I hope that he will reassure us today that he has taken this point on board—that there were five years in which to address the issue.
The Minister is pointing at the time. I am very willing to let him reply now, because I hope that he will be able to give us some reassurance that the Home Office will sympathetically consider the predicament of the Devon fire and rescue service.
§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mr. Mike O'Brien)I congratulate the hon. Member for Tiverton and Honiton (Mrs. Browning) on securing this debate. I would have hoped to have had a longer opportunity to deal in more detail with the concerns that she expressed, but she took up 20 minutes of this 30-minute debate—although I fully understand the importance that she and her constituents attach to the quality of the fire service in Devon, as well as the issues relating to radio replacement.
We have good reason to be proud of our fire service. Its high level of performance in response to emergency calls has been confirmed year after year by the Audit Commission. On the latest figures published by the commission, the fire service nationally in 1998–99 met attendance standards in responding to fire calls on 789 96 per cent. of occasions. In Devon, even that excellent performance was bettered, with attendance standards being met on 97.1 per cent. of occasions.
I will take no lessons from the hon. Lady on the subject of funding support for the fire service. The real-terms increases provided by this Government, both revenue and capital, are significantly better than those provided in the last years of the Conservative Administration in which she served. She may complain about fire service funding now, but she supported the starving of the fire service.
§ Mr. John Burnett (Torridge and West Devon)The fire service in London is a separate precepting authority, as are the police. Does the Minister agree that it would be a good idea for crucial services such as the Devon fire and rescue service to have the same arrangement, so that it can plan for changes in communications and such in the long term?
§ Mr. O'BrienThat is an interesting issue. The Government are currently holding consultations on local government funding, and no doubt the Devon service could make submissions.
Under the central-local partnership arrangements we work closely with fire service interests to assess future funding pressures and we have taken those into account in both spending reviews. The outcome of spending review 2000 is that fire authorities in England will get an overall increase in the fire service element of standard spending assessment of £189.2 million over the next three years, including £69.1 million—that is 5 per cent. more—for 2001–02, followed by an increase of 4 per cent. in each of the two subsequent years.
We announced earlier today that, for 2001–02, the fire standard spending assessment for Devon will provisionally be increased by 4.4 per cent., following the 4.5 per cent. that was received this year. As part of spending review 2000, we are also significantly boosting our support for fire service capital. Planned credit approvals for the service in England and Wales will be increased by 67 per cent. from their present level of £35.7 million, to £59.7 million in 2001–02. The provision will be sustained at that level in 2002–03 and increased by a further £2 million to £61.7 million in 2003–04. I have announced that a significant proportion—10 million of the provision for 2001-02—will be issued as a supplementary credit approval specifically for the promotion of equality and diversity in the service.
Spending review 2000 represents overall, I believe, a very satisfactory outcome for the fire service. It will help to deliver the outcomes that really matter, reducing the number of fires and fire deaths in the home through a greater emphasis on fire safety and prevention. At the same time, it rightly sets challenging efficiency targets. The spending totals are based on an assumption that a 2 per cent. improvement in efficiency will be achieved each year. The best value process that the Government have introduced from 1 April will play a key role in helping fire authorities to identify and achieve those efficiencies.
I am well aware of the concerns that Devon fire and rescue service has about funding issues. In July I met a delegation representing those fire authorities, including 790 Devon, which serve large rural areas. I took careful note of the problems they identified, particularly in relation to the current arrangements for distributing funding.
The cause of the problem is the standard spending assessment formula that we inherited, and it needs to change. The Home Office has been involved in a fundamental review of local government finance, in particular the perverse funding incentives, which we inherited in relation to the fire funding formula. The incentives have caused a lot of problems not only in Devon but in many other parts of the country. For example, funding is reduced if the number of fire calls are reduced. Such decisions need to be changed and we are committed to doing that.
On radio communications, we understand and acknowledge the need for fire authorities to replace their wide-area radio schemes in the period up to 2005. Indeed, we took account of this in the previous spending review.
The hon. Lady referred to the arrangements for the police. The police service has a national strategy in place and a public safety radio communication service known as Airwave is in the process of being introduced. We are convinced that the police will draw considerable benefit from that cohesive approach, which is supported by appropriate funding arrangements.
§ Mrs. BrowningWill the Minister give way?
§ Mr. O'BrienI have some points that I wish to make. I am sure that the hon. Lady would wish me to do that, and then if we have time left, I will happily give way to her. It is important that I make these points so that those in the fire and rescue service know the Government's position.
Devon and Cornwall constabulary will receive an allocation of Airwave grant of £4,755,000 in capital for 2001–02 and £2,470,000 in revenue. The spectrum, which is used by the fire service, will be withdrawn from its current use at the end of 2005, although some fire services, including Devon, may wish to make changes earlier than that date.
There are no plans to auction the use of those frequencies. They will be retained by the Home Office for other purposes. The Wireless Telegraphy Act 1998 provided a mechanism for promoting the efficient use of radio frequencies by introducing licence fees reflecting the commercial value of the spectrum. The charge for the fire service would increase from £197,000 to £746,000 a year. The new charging regime is being phased in over a five-year period from April 1999. The method of apportionment between brigades was agreed with fire service representatives. The increase in costs was one of the funding pressures identified and taken into account in the comprehensive spending review.
The challenge for the fire service is to secure benefits that are similar to those of the police in their method of procurement. The hon. Lady referred to the urgency of the matter. That is why we have asked, this year, for all fire authorities in England and Wales to undertake best value reviews of their future communications and control 791 arrangements. Given the statutory responsibilities of local fire authorities, both for the efficiency of their brigades and for securing best value, it would be quite wrong to set aside the local consideration. However, a sensible outcome will, I believe, depend on local decisions being made and local government being willing to work with central Government to secure systems that will meet certain key criteria. In particular, radio bearer systems procured by fire authorities must meet the service's national operational requirements for voice communications and status and data message transfer. They must support effective interworking between neighbouring brigades. They must, as Airwave would, provide an effective and continuing interface with communications systems of other emergency services.
These are national requirements; so is the need to secure value for money. There will have to be competition, but it would be nonsense if each fire authority mounted its own competition for a replacement radio bearer system. The waste in administrative effort, the loss of economies of scale and the unreasonable requirement on suppliers to interface with a large number of different systems would be unacceptable.
792 If fire authorities want to control the process, I want them to be able to demonstrate a real commitment to collaborative procurement in order to deliver an outcome that makes sense both locally in Devon and nationally across the country.
§ Mrs. BrowningThe Minister said that fire authorities may, if they wish, change their radio communication systems earlier than 2005. Will he take on board that for Devon, that is not an optional extra? The fire service has been required by the police, whose facilities it shares at present, to end its contract with them by the end of 2002.
§ Mr. O'BrienI had hoped to reply at greater length about the issues relating to the radio communication system, but we are obviously very pressed for time. I will soon be meeting Local Government Association representatives and others. We are ready and willing to—
§ The motion having been made after Ten o'clock, and the debate having continued for half an hour, MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER adjourned the House without Question put, pursuant to the Standing Order.
§ Adjourned accordingly at One o'clock.