HC Deb 10 May 2000 vol 349 cc827-9
4. Mr. Paul Burstow (Sutton and Cheam)

When the final "Listening to Older People" event will take place; and if she will make a statement. [120436]

The Parliamentary Secretary, Cabinet Office (Mr. Graham Stringer)

The Government take listening and responding to older people very seriously. That is why we launched last May our "Listening to Older People" programme. Eleven "Listening to Older People" events took place throughout the country last year. This stage of the programme culminates in a national listening event in London on 17 May, where we will launch a programme of action to respond to the issues raised during the listening programme.

Mr. Burstow

Can the Minister tell the House whether at any of the "Listening to Older People" meetings the question of the wide variation in home-care charges was raised with Ministers? Today, the Audit Commission has revealed the stark reality of exceedingly wide variations of charges throughout the country. It has exposed the fact also that one in three councils are driving pensioners into poverty by their charging policies. What will the Government do about this? Will they announce concrete action at the final conference on 17 May?

Mr. Stringer

Yes, care charges were discussed at the events that took place. The Government will respond later this year to the Audit Commission's report, which was published today, as we will respond to the royal commission report on care later this year.

Ms Linda Perham (Ilford, North)

Does my hon. Friend the Minister agree that this series of events proves that we are widening the debate beyond pensions issues for older people and engaging with ordinary individuals? We have already introduced a wide range of measures for older people. Will my hon. Friend comment on the progress of the better government for older people programme?

Mr. Stringer

I thank my hon. Friend for that question. She is right. The 28 pilot projects that arose from the better government for older people programme covered a range of areas of concern for elderly people, from action against crime to better responsiveness by the health service, better transport and precise care for Asian elders in Bolton. The projects are at the end of their natural life, but I suspect that the local authorities that sponsored them will continue with much of the work that was undertaken while the Government assess and evaluate the projects.

Mr. Andrew Lansley (South Cambridgeshire)

Does the Minister realise that pensioners do not believe that the Government are listening to them? In the document that launched his programme, the Prime Minister said: financial security is crucial for older people. Will the Minister explain why the Government have raised council taxes by more than three times the rate of inflation, abolished the married couples allowance for those becoming pensioners, increased the level of tax on pensioners with modest savings and imposed a £5 billion tax on pension funds for those who will become pensioners?

Mr. Stringer

From my experience of listening to elderly people, they know exactly what the Conservative party did during its time in office. They remember that the Conservative Government removed the link between earnings and pensions and thereby created the greatest diversity of income among pensioners in western Europe. They know also—I am sure that the hon. Gentleman will acknowledge and confirm this—that the Conservatives propose to abolish the minimum income guarantee, which has benefited more than 1 million pensioners, and also oppose the winter fuel payment. They certainly would not have brought those benefits to pensioners had they been in power.

Mr. Lansley

Pensioners will not be diverted by the Minister from their experience of what has happened under the Government. When it comes to experience, will the Minister confirm that one of his 28 pilot projects is in Hartlepool? Will he explain why it makes any sense to have a pilot project of listening to older people in Hartlepool while the right hon. Member for Hartlepool (Mr. Mandelson) is attending Labour party meetings and saying that there is no mileage for the Labour party in pensioners? The consequence of that was a one-third reduction in the Labour vote in Hartlepool last Thursday. That will continue while the Labour party fails to deliver to pensioners.

Mr. Stringer

The pensioners to whom I listened are aware of the damage that the Conservative party has done to pensioners and the damage that it would do if it were ever to return to power. They recognise also that the £6.5 billion that the Government have put into pensioners' pockets would not have reached them had the Conservatives been in power. None of those initiatives would have been taken by the hon. Gentleman's party. When the Conservative Government were in power, he was more interested in raising charges on eye tests than in making access to the health service free for those tests.