Business of the House (Hansard, 20 April 2000)

§ The President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons (Mrs. Margaret Beckett)
With permission, Madam Speaker, I shall make a statement on the business of the House. The business for the week after the Easter recess will be as follows:
TUESDAY 2 MAY—Progress on consideration in Committee of the Finance Bill.
WEDNESDAY 3 MAY—Conclusion of consideration in Committee of the Finance Bill.
THURSDAY 4 MAY—Debate on defence in the world on a motion for the Adjournment of the House.
FRIDAY 5 MAY—Private Members' Bills.
The provisional business for the following week will be as follows:
MONDAY 8 MAY—Remaining stages of the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Bill.
TUESDAY 9 MAY—Progress on remaining stages of the Transport Bill.
WEDNESDAY 10 MAY—Conclusion of remaining stages of the Transport Bill.
THURSDAY 11 MAY—Debate on the common agricultural policy on a Government motion. Details will be given in the Official Report.
FRIDAY 12 MAY—Private Members' Bills.

§ Sir Patrick Cormack (South Staffordshire)
I thank the right hon. Lady for outlining the business for the two weeks after we return. I hope that, if the pattern of this morning's sitting is repeated in future, the business statement will be made at 9.30 am before the Adjournment debate begins or at 12.30 pm when it finishes. It is unfortunate to have to interrupt them.
The right hon. Lady will know about the enormous anxiety in the House and throughout the country about the unfolding tragedy in Zimbabwe. Although it is unlikely that there will be cause to recall the House next week. will she try to ensure that the Foreign Secretary makes a statement to the House to explain the current position when we reassemble on 2 May? Events in Zimbabwe underline the need for the House to have a proper debate on foreign affairs in the near future. It is some time since we held a wide-ranging debate on foreign affairs.
We have asked for a statement on the inter-governmental conference White Paper, and we still do not know when we shall have that.
1101 Will the right hon. Lady tell us when the Second Reading of the Northern Ireland police Bill is likely to take place? She knows that there is considerable interest in the subject in all parties.
Although the right hon. Lady responded positively to requests for a debate on long-term care, we have not yet had an opportunity to discover the Government's conclusions on that important subject. It has been raised this morning in the Adjournment debate as the Parliamentary Secretary knows. We should be grateful for a statement in the near future.
The right hon. Lady has admitted several times that, with the reversion of the Budget to the old date, the pattern for economic debates is not satisfactory. When is she likely to present proposals for regularly spaced debates on the economy and public expenditure?
Is the right hon. Lady any nearer being able to propose a proper pattern of sittings for the whole year? I ask that not because of my concern about the precise dates of recesses but because the staff the House are anxious to know them. She might know that the Doorkeepers open golf tournament takes place on 2 August. I have been approached this morning and asked whether that will have to be cancelled. Perhaps we could be given some idea about the pattern for the rest of this year.
I wish the right hon. Lady a happy Easter.

§ Mrs. Beckett
I am grateful to the hon. Member for South Staffordshire (Sir P. Cormack) and return his good wishes for Easter to him and the House.
I take the hon. Gentleman's point about making the business statement at the beginning or the end of proceedings under today's circumstances. We thought that sticking to our usual slot, even on a Friday pattern sitting, would be for the convenience of the House. However, I note his remarks.
The hon. Gentleman mentioned the deteriorating situation in Zimbabwe. It causes great anxiety in all parties. I shall draw his remarks to the attention of the Foreign Secretary, who will do his utmost to keep the House informed. The hon. Gentleman specifically asked whether we could make a statement on 2 May. The Commonwealth ministerial action group is meeting on 2 and 3 May—I fear that I cannot recall the location—and the Foreign Secretary will attend it. His attendance might be incompatible with making a statement to the House. However, I am sure that the Foreign Secretary wants to keep the House informed.
I cannot provide dates for the intergovernmental conference White Paper debate, Second Reading of the Northern Ireland police Bill or a debate on the Government's conclusions on long-term care. On the latter, I shall draw the remarks of the hon. Member for South Staffordshire to the attention of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Health.
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for reminding me that as yet we have no settled pattern for economic debates. We shall reconsider that. On more certainty about when the House is likely to sit during the year, I am pleased to hear an Opposition Member expressing anxiety about the impact of our decisions on the staff of the House. That is sometimes overlooked. I take his point 1102 about unpredictability. That is one of the reasons for the Modernisation Committee's recommendation, following the Jopling committee recommendation, of greater use of motions for programming the discussion of our debates. Such motions are likely to promote better discussion of issues in Government proposals that hon. Members in all parties identify as important and also because the lack of such agreements contributes to the unpredictability and uncertainty to which the hon. Gentleman referred.
I omitted to provide some information. Last week, I said that there would be a debate on a Select Committee report in Westminster Hall on 11 May. We now know that it will be the second report this Session of the Select Committee on Science and Technology on engineering and physical sciences-based innovation.

§ Mr. Dale Campbell-Savours (Workington)
When I hear Opposition spokesmen refer to patterns of sittings, I start to worry. It is as if the Opposition are trying to fix the business.

§ Mr. Dennis Skinner (Bolsover)
They will be asking for guillotines next.

§ Mr. Campbell-Savours
The unpredictability and uncertainty in the House strengthens it and makes the institution what it is.
Is there any news on our annual debate on the Intelligence and Security Committee report?

§ Mrs. Beckett
I am afraid that I cannot provide a date for that debate, but I bear in mind the pressure to hold it. Of course, I take my hon. Friend's point about the anxiety that he and other long-serving Members feel when the Opposition seek a more predictable pattern of debates that they are trying to create difficulties in the Government's handling of business. However, there is merit in reaching common-sense agreements so that important issues can be aired and the House has an opportunity to scrutinise them. I heard my hon. Friend the Member for Bolsover (Mr. Skinner) say sotto voce that the Opposition will be calling for guillotines next. He will remember that the Leader of the Opposition did that not long ago.

§ Mr. Paul Tyler (North Cornwall)
While we all welcome the fact that the Government try to give notice of business several weeks in advance, what is the rationale for changing the business for Thursday 4 May, which is an important date for many hon. Members? The change has caused some confusion. A debate was supposed to be held on the Wakeham report on the reform of the House of Lords. Many hon. Members intended to give up the chance to meet their electorate to be present at that debate. However, the business has been changed to a debate on defence. That means that those who had to be in their constituencies have to change their arrangements. Many hon. Members, including members of the Select Committee on Defence, will find it difficult to be present on that day. Why has that change been made?
We endorse the views of the hon. Member for South Staffordshire (Sir P. Cormack) on Zimbabwe. As the Leader of the House pointed out, our return will coincide with a meeting of the Commonwealth leaders. I hope that there will be an early report to the House about what action the Commonwealth can take, hopefully under British leadership, to deal with the deteriorating situation.
1103 I endorse the views of not only the hon. Member for South Staffordshire but many other hon. Members about the need for a Government statement as soon as possible on long-term care for the elderly. Many hon. Members have expressed that view over several weeks.
Finally, I endorse the view that we should wish each other a happy Easter.

§ Mrs. Beckett
I of course understand that, whenever we change the provisional business that has been announced, there are always as many complaints as there are congratulations. I understand that doing so can create difficulties for Members, and of course understand the point about the Defence Committee.
The hon. Gentleman will appreciate that several defence debates are scheduled. We strive to accommodate the concerns of the Defence Committee, which include, for example, providing timely debates following completion of its reports and so on. However, there are occasions on which, unfortunately, we cannot accommodate all its requests.
I of course take the hon. Gentleman's point about the debate scheduled for 4 May. I am not entirely sure—this is not a criticism—that he was with us for lasts week's business statement. If he was, he will recall that the right hon. Member for North-West Hampshire (Sir G. Young), the Opposition spokesman, specifically asked us not to stage the House of Lords reform debate on 4 May—indeed, a number of Members expressed that view—because, although all the issues that we debate are of importance, and we would not find time for them on the Floor of the House if they were not, there is a feeling that the debate is a matter of considerable constitutional import and many Members, who otherwise might be engaged on local election day, wish to take part in it.
I note, too, the hon. Gentleman's remarks about Members having been prepared to give up the chance to meet their electorate. I am sure that they are now even more happy that they will not need to make that sacrifice. I also take on board his remarks about both Zimbabwe and long-term care.

§ Dr. Nick Palmer (Broxtowe)
Will my right hon. Friend take on board the widespread interest in the Government's new policy planning guidance note 6, which will help protect the green belt? However, does she recognise the concern that we are still hamstrung by the structure and other plans that, in some cases, were made many years ago? Will she try to schedule a debate on those issues in the reasonably near future, perhaps combining consideration of the Government's forthcoming White Papers on urban and rural planning, and response to the Rogers report?

§ Mrs. Beckett
My hon. Friend makes an interesting point, especially as he ties in other documents with his proposal for an examination of such issues. I fear that I cannot undertake to find time in the near future for such a debate on the Floor. He might find a debate in Westminster Hall a more fruitful opportunity. However, I certainly take on board his point about several issues coming together.

§ Rev. Martin Smyth (Belfast, South)
I appreciate the pressure on the House's business, but join those who are calling for a major debate on foreign affairs. Although I 1104 also appreciate concerns about Zimbabwe, there is an even greater tragedy in Ethiopia. May we have an opportunity to see how we as a people are pressing the world to help that situation?
I also join those who are expressing season's greetings. I hope that we might all enter into the wonder and mystery of Good Friday and the thrilling joy of Easter day.

§ Mrs. Beckett
I am most grateful to the hon. Gentleman, as I know is the whole House. I certainly take on board his point about the number of foreign affairs issues that are arising. I shall endeavour to raise that matter with the Foreign Secretary.

§ Mr. Alan Hurst (Braintree)
I am sure that my right hon. Friend will be aware of the ease of travelling on our roads during the Easter school holidays. In the light of such ease when parents are not driving their children to school, will she find time for a debate on home-to-school transport provision?

§ Mrs. Beckett
Again, I recommend Westminster Hall. I entirely take my hon. Friend's point about the contrast. I saw an interesting description the other day of something that is called a walking bus, which gathers school children to take them to school. That is thought to be conducive to safety and to easing parents' fears. I know that some experiments are being undertaken, but I fear that it is unlikely that I shall find time in the near future for such a debate on the Floor of the House.

§ Mr. John Bercow (Buckingham)
I, too, wish the right hon. Lady and her husband a happy Easter, although I feel sure that they will both sorely miss the company of right hon. and hon. Members.
When will we have the delayed but important annual debate on small businesses—a matter of great concern to them, as they constitute 99.6 per cent. of all British enterprises, employ approximately half of the private sector work force and contribute two fifths of our national output?
May we have as early as possible a further statement on progress in the proposed appointment of the chairman of the Appointments Commission, on which the Parliamentary Secretary, Privy Council Office had a few words to say on Tuesday afternoon? I hope that nominations have not yet closed, though the appointment is to be made very soon. Does the Leader of the House agree that, in view of the importance of that person being characterised by experience, impartiality and a spirit of public service, one outstanding candidate for the post would be my right hon. Friend the Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth)? I hope that she will undertake vigorously to lobby on his behalf.

§ Mrs. Beckett
I am most grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his kind remarks. I am sorry and surprised that, uncharacteristically, the right hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth) is not present.

§ Mr. Skinner
It is his day off.

§ Mrs. Beckett
Perhaps he is having a day off, which makes a change.
1105 There is a slight inconsistency in the comments of the hon. Member for Buckingham (Mr. Bercow) about the Appointments Commission. On one hand, he hopes that nominations are not closed, but on the other, that there is an early announcement. Those statements seem not to be mutually compatible. However, I anticipate that an announcement will be made very soon.
I hope that the hon. Gentleman will forgive me for entering the caveat that a debate on small businesses is not an assured annual event, although the Government endeavour to find a regular, suitable opportunity for one. I say that only because, as he will know, one does not have to be in this Chamber for very long, listening to Members calling for annual debates on a variety of burning issues, to realise that we would never do anything if we agreed to all such requests.
It is difficult to tear oneself away from this place. We shall definitely miss right hon. and hon. Members, but we shall just have to steel ourselves.