HC Deb 25 January 1999 vol 324 cc15-6
34. Mr. Ben Bradshaw (Exeter)

How much account is taken, when setting bishops' stipends, of allowances paid to some bishops for attending the House of Lords. [65557]

Mr. Stuart Bell (Second Church Estates Commissioner, representing the Church Commissioners)

These payments represent reimbursement of costs incurred, so bishops' stipends are not adjusted because of them.

Mr. Bradshaw

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that reply. Does he acknowledge that the system has the potential to create great inequality in bishops' ultimate incomes? Does he agree that it perhaps makes sense to pool the money gained from attendance at the House of Lords and to share it out in a true Christian manner among bishops? In the light of the Government's proposals to change the make-up of the upper House, will there be some sort of review of whether to include representatives of other denominations Christian, as well as those of other faiths?

Mr. Bell

I note my hon. Friend's views, but he will have seen and welcomed the White Paper on the future of the upper House, in which the Government state that bishops make a valuable contribution in the House because of their particular perspective and experience. The Church welcomes the Government's proposal to retain the present size of the Bishops Bench, which they accept is justified. In relation to other faiths, the Church has always insisted that it wishes to be inclusive rather than exclusive, so long as that does not touch on the established Church.

Mrs. Gwyneth Dunwoody (Crewe and Nantwich)

Is my hon. Friend aware that many of us welcome the presence of bishops in the upper House, and that it is precisely the fact that they represent areas not only within the south-east establishment but elsewhere in the United Kingdom which gives them the ability to transmit not only the views of their parishioners but frequently those of the many different professions with which they come into constant contact?

Mr. Bell

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. She confirms the statement in the White Paper in relation to the bishops—that the present representation makes it possible for the Church to ensure that its perspective is represented on all occasions when it would be of particular value. One has to understand that the Church of England is a part of our community throughout the land and that it reflects the views of our people, which are then reflected in the upper House.