HC Deb 31 March 1998 vol 309 cc1024-5
7. Mr. Pickles

When he next plans to meet representatives of local government in shire areas to discuss the conduct of local government. [35447]

Ms Armstrong

Earlier this month, my right hon. Friend the Deputy Prime Minister chaired a meeting of the central-local partnership, the forum where senior Ministers and leading Local Government Association members discuss major issues affecting local government. Two further meetings of the partnership are planned for later this year.

Mr. Pickles

Those who attended that meeting were left with the impression that the Government favour the Local Government (Experimental Arrangements) Bill, which was introduced in another place and proposes a fundamental change to the way in which local authorities are conducted. The Bill is so important that it will receive its Second Reading in this Chamber, but the only way in which it can proceed is if the Government provide additional time. County councillors have formed the impression that the Government are favourable to that view. When can we expect an announcement?

Ms Armstrong

The hon. Gentleman clearly has not had a chance to read last week's Adjournment debate, when this matter was discussed. We are always keen to support proposals from local government to ensure that it is more responsive to local people. I understand that the hon. Gentleman's county council is interested in proposing ideas for experimentation. The Bill addresses experimentation in local government; it is not the Government saying, "This is what you ought to do." We need to be sure that local government has the opportunity to experiment. That is in the hands of the House, including Opposition Members.

Mr. Bill O'Brien

I thank my hon. Friend for her efforts to try to improve the conduct of local government. In the experiments to which she referred, her attention will be drawn to the need to bring the standard spending assessment nearer the actual expenditure of local government. Will she try to narrow the gap between the SSA and expenditure to help the conduct of local government?

Ms Armstrong

Yesterday, we published three consultation papers governing local authority finance in which we addressed the future of grant distribution and the SSA, and offered ideas. We are also encouraging ideas from local government.

It is important that central Government listen to and work with local government. I look forward to the responses to yesterday's document.

Sir Norman Fowler

Let me returning to the point raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr. Pickles). Is it not a fact that the Local Government (Experimental Arrangements) Bill is a controversial measure drafted entirely by the Government but introduced in another place by a private Member? Is it not also a fact that the Government want it to go on to the statute book without a Second Reading debate in this place on its principle? Surely that is unacceptable. Is it not another example of the Government attempting to bypass the House and the normal checks of parliamentary democracy?

Ms Armstrong

I seem to remember that the previous Administration pursued the same route with a Bill to open up committees in local government. I am not in charge of, nor can I control, the amount of time that Opposition Members want to take debating Bills on Second Reading. If Opposition Members were prepared to curtail discussion on other Bills, we would welcome a Second Reading debate in private Members' time. We are talking about a private Member's Bill, not a Government Bill. When the Government have to take forward such measures, we shall ensure that they receive proper attention in Government time.