HC Deb 03 December 1998 vol 321 cc1031-3
6. Sir Teddy Taylor (Rochford and Southend, East)

What the total deficit in all trade with the EU has been since 1973 in 1998 prices. [61297]

The Minister for Trade (Mr. Brian Wilson)

Figures measuring EU trade since 1973 in 1998 prices are not available. In the first nine months of 1998 the deficit on trade in goods with EU countries was £3.2 billion.

Sir Teddy Taylor

Does the Minister agree that, since we joined the EEC, our deficit in overall trade has been £155,000 million, which is equivalent to £6,000 million every year or, put another way, £16 million every day of the week, including Saturdays and Sundays? Does that not suggest that those who argued that membership of the EU would improve our trade were perhaps over-optimistic? More significantly, does the Minister agree that, bearing in mind that we have a serious structural deficit in trade with Europe, it could create appalling problems for jobs and prosperity in Britain if we were to join the EMU?

Mr. Wilson

I do not agree with the last proposition. Ultimately, it will be a decision for the British people to take, hopefully on the basis of rational argument and the evidence put before them. I have no doubt that the hon. Gentleman will participate in presenting such evidence according to his own views.

The figures quoted by the hon. Gentleman are highly selective and do not provide anything approaching the full picture of our relationship with the rest of the European Union. He must be aware that the sort of figures he was seeking are badly skewed by the fact that, although, as I said, there is a £350 million a month deficit on goods just now, in the late 1980s, under the Government of whom he was a supporter, the monthly deficit was £1.5 billion. The figures that he wants are not as simple as it may seem.

He might also take into account the investment into the United Kingdom not only from the rest of the EU but from elsewhere that we certainly would not receive if we were not a European Union member.

Mr. Llew Smith (Blaenau Gwent)

Will the Minister explain how our trading position with the European Union—and our ability to create jobs—would improve if we ever decided to hand over to the European Union power over interest rates, public expenditure levels and taxation?

Mr. Wilson

Those are all evolving matters on which the Government and—on EMU—the British people will eventually give their verdict. This week, my right hon. Friend the Chancellor, and, today, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and my hon. Friend the Minister for Small Firms, Trade and Industry have made it perfectly clear that nothing will be done by the Government that damages British competitiveness. That is the starting point. Attempting to adduce wholly anti-EMU arguments as if our relationship with Europe is an entirely negative one is unrealistic. It is an argument of the 1970s rather than the 1990s.

Mr. Ian Taylor (Esher and Walton)

Does the Minister accept that the 150 business men who signed the Financial Times advertisement, which already carried more than 100 signatures—so we are talking about 250 or so business men—stating that they want the Government to provide greater clarification on the EMU entry timetable did so precisely because they are worried about trading prospects for United Kingdom companies after 1 January, when one single currency will dominate 80 per cent. of the single market? Will he assure the House that he will take up with the Treasury the need for it to be much clearer on how British economic policy will achieve convergence, so that the Minister himself can achieve the Secretary of State's objective of ensuring that the question is "when" not "if"?

Mr. Wilson

Since May 1997, the Treasury's policies have been absolutely clear and have carried widespread public support. Part of the problem for the Treasury and the Government in the debate on Europe is that, for the last 18 years, that debate has been skewed by irrational hostility of exactly the type we heard again today from the hon. Member for Rochford and Southend, East (Sir T. Taylor).

Mr. Ben Bradshaw (Exeter)

Does the Minister accept that, by any measure, our trade deficit with Europe would be much worse if we were not in the European Union? Does he also share the concern of many Labour Members, most Liberal Democrats and the few remaining sane Conservative Members that our exporters will suffer a disadvantage as long as we remain outside the euro zone?

Mr. Wilson

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to mention the other side of the coin of our trade relations with the European Union: more than half our exports are to the European Union. I was certainly very pleased to note in last month's trade figures—particularly against the background of difficulties elsewhere in the world—that the value and volume of our exports to fellow EU countries increased in that period. Moreover, we still have a very substantial inflow of investment from EU countries. In general, it is a healthy and balanced relationship. I entirely agree with my hon. Friend that, if by any mischance we were outside that relationship, the United Kingdom's economic prospects would be very much worse than they are now.