Multi-party Talks

HC Deb 08 April 1998 vol 310 cc338-42

3. Mr. John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington)

If she will make a statement on progress in the all-party talks. [36891]

5. Mr. David Winnick (Walsall, North)

If she will make a statement on the current peace talks. [36893]

7. Mr. Andrew Hunter (Basingstoke)

If she will make a statement on the all-party talks. [36895]

9. Mr. Harry Barnes (North-East Derbyshire)

If she will make a statement on progress in the multi-party talks. [36897]

The Minister of State, Northern Ireland Office (Mr. Adam Ingram)

After two years of negotiations, and under the skilful guidance of Senator Mitchell, the participants are in the final stages of reaching a comprehensive political agreement. On Tuesday morning, Senator Mitchell tabled a draft paper for discussion in the talks. The paper is predominantly a synthesis of the views of the parties and the two Governments, and aims to satisfy as many people as possible.

It is not surprising that differences have emerged between the parties, but those are matters to be resolved within the talks. In that context, my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has said that he will do all he can to help the parties to reach agreement, and that is exactly what he and the Taoiseach are doing at present.

I am sure that the House will want to join me in sending our condolences to Mr. Ahern on the death of his mother and in expressing our appreciation of his continued involvement in the talks at this sad time.

The parties have shown leadership and courage to bring us to this point. I have no doubt that they will renew their efforts as we move towards the end of the negotiations. We owe it to the people of Northern Ireland to reach an agreement which will provide a peaceful and stable society, for which so many people have worked over the years.

Mr. McDonnell

By way of introduction, I should say that we have all been aware that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has borne the brunt of the talks for the past 10 months in most difficult personal health circumstances, and I ask my hon. Friend the Minister to convey my and, I am sure, all hon. Members' thanks to the Secretary of State for bearing that brunt, and for her commitment to securing what we hope will be an historic negotiated settlement tomorrow.

May I also convey the need, after tomorrow, for the maintenance of a momentum towards peace—considering deadlines for dealing with issues, such as the situation of political prisoners in Northern Ireland and their future release, the demilitarisation of the six counties, reform of the Royal Ulster Constabulary and the empowerment of the new democratic structures, which I hope will enable us to hear the united voice of the Irish people?

Mr. Ingram

I am sure that the whole House will share the sentiments expressed by my hon. Friend about the efforts, energy and commitment that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has put into the negotiations, not only during the past 10 months, but in her previous role as shadow Secretary of State for Northern Ireland. She has been fully engaged with the process during that period.

My hon. Friend asks about the momentum and the need to continue a process beyond this. The House will realise that peace is not an event but a process, and the process will begin following the signing of any agreement, which we hope will take place within the next 36 hours or so. I have no doubt that that will be a complicated agreement, but it is one that everyone must ensure is implemented in full, and it can be implemented in full only with the whole-hearted support of the people of Northern Ireland and all hon. Members.

Mr. Winnick

As we all hope agreement will be reached, shall we praise not only, of course, the representatives of the British and Irish Governments, but Senator George Mitchell, who has undoubtedly dedicated so much effort to trying to secure a negotiated agreement? Does my hon. Friend agree that, if there is one message today above all others that should go out, it is that all the parties involved in the talks should continue until agreement is reached?

Mr. Ingram

Again, I am grateful to my hon. Friend for pointing out the role played by Senator George Mitchell. Of course, many others have played an important role, such as the co-chairmen who have worked alongside him in chairing the talks proceedings and the independent commission on decommissioning. It is important that we continue on the basis that he has described, and that is exactly what is happening in Belfast at this moment.

Mr. Hunter

Although I greatly hope that agreement can be reached this week, will the Minister explain why, in less than three months from being broadly accepted, the heads of agreement paper has come to be regarded as a blueprint pointing towards the creation of a united Ireland?

Mr. Ingram

The hon. Gentleman refers to the heads of agreement document, but the process has moved on since then. That document is a matter for discussion within the talks, and the important talks that are taking place in Belfast at this moment have been framed around that particular document. It is for the talks' participants to determine and structure the best way forward, and on that we wish them godspeed.

Mr. Barnes

The Minister will be aware that there are awkward squads in the Labour party which are opposed to changes in single parent benefits and have views on spending limits that are different from those of Front-Bench spokesmen. However, wherever one goes, a characteristic within the Labour party is the popularity of the views of our right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and the Front-Bench team, and the work they are doing to achieve peace and reconciliation in Northern Ireland. Everything needs to be done to support those moves and to encourage the politicians involved in the talks on all sides to reconcile their different positions and reach an agreement that we can all support, and which will be supported in referendums throughout the whole of Ireland.

Mr. Ingram

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for his comments. As someone who has been closely engaged in this whole process over many years, he has been a positive player in trying to bring about a better society in Northern Ireland. He has made his contribution towards achieving a peaceful and lasting settlement there.

Mr. William Ross (East Londonderry)

Is the Minister telling us that he is not aware of the assumption now spreading across Northern Ireland that the draft agreement presented to the Stormont talks participants on Monday evening is so outrageous in its terms and content that it could not possibly be considered as the real paper, and that a second authentic and watered-down version of that document will be presented before tomorrow's deadline? The assumption is that it is an attempt to convince people that considerable concessions have been made to the Unionist position, especially in regard to articles 2 and 3 of the Irish constitution, and an attempt to blackmail the Ulster Unionist party into accepting the unwarranted interference in the government of Northern Ireland.

Mr. Ingram

I would not want to respond to assumptions or perceptions. That has been part of the problem of trying to move the process forward. We have to deal with the realities, which is what the talks participants are doing at this very moment. They are trying to deal with the harsh realities and with the various papers coming before them. They are having to reconcile their differences in order to reach an eventual agreement.

Mr. Roger Stott (Wigan)

My hon. Friend the Minister has been part of the team trying to get a solution to the problem. He will be aware that there are splinter elements within Northern Ireland which do not want to see a solution to the problem, as evidenced in Londonderry last night. Will my hon. Friend join me in congratulating the Royal Ulster Constabulary and, particularly of late, the Garda Siochana, on their recent success in intercepting material for planned terrorist attacks that could have had devastating consequences on the mainland of Britain?

Mr. Ingram

Every time there has been a murder or a bombing attempt, it has been said from the Dispatch Box—we cannot repeat it often enough—that there are brave men and women in the RUC, the Garda Siochana and the security forces north and south of the border. Over recent weeks, they have stopped major bombing attempts in Northern Ireland and, most recently, in Great Britain. They have our heartfelt thanks for all their efforts in that regard.

Mr. Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire)

I reiterate how pleased we are that the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland is not here today. I am sure that the Minister agrees that her presence in Northern Ireland, together with the Prime Minister, underlines the commitment of all hon. Members in the Chamber to a peaceful resolution to the talks. In that spirit, will the Minister encourage the Unionist politicians to consider seriously taking up their places on the British-Irish inter-parliamentary body, given that there is no cost to them in doing so and that it would enhance their influence enormously in north-south questions which they consider to be of great importance—and I agree with their assessment?

Mr. Ingram

I will not comment on where I would rather the Secretary of State was, but I am sure that what she is doing is immensely important. That is what we have been talking about today. The hon. Gentleman's serious point is a matter for individual political parties. I am sure that the Ulster Unionist party will have heard the hon. Gentleman's sentiments and will have taken careful note of them.

Mr. Andrew Robathan (Blaby)

I am sure that all hon. Members must want peace in Northern Ireland, and I pay tribute to the Minister and the Secretary of State for their hard work in pursuit of peace. Does he accept that peace must be built on solid foundations? During the talks, Sinn Fein-IRA, among others, has continued to talk peace while it has—week in, week out—been involved in punishment beatings as well as some murders, as the Minister knows. Will he reassure the House that he will not pursue peace at any price?

Mr. Ingram

The hon. Gentleman should be aware that two parties participating in the talks were removed from the proceedings because it was adjudged that they had breached the Mitchell principles. Those parties were readmitted to the talks by the other participants on the basis of the best available security advice—from the security forces and the Chief Constable—about their actions as political parties with links with paramilitary and terrorist groups.

Mr. Malcolm Moss (North-East Cambridgeshire)

I begin by wishing, on behalf of Opposition Front Benchers, all those involved in the final stage of the talks process well in their search for a successful outcome before tomorrow's deadline. The Conservative party, as much as all the participating parties, would welcome a settlement.

In the heads of agreement that were issued—and apparently supported—by the Government on 12 January, the north-south relationships of strand 2 were to be essentially consultative and accountable to the new Northern Ireland assembly. Judging by the reaction of the Ulster Unionist and Alliance parties, it seems that the Mitchell paper issued this week has resurrected the idea that was rejected long ago of north-south bodies with executive powers. Why do the Government appear to have changed their position on that issue? Do they now favour a council of Ministers which will have executive powers and be completely independent of an assembly?

Mr. Ingram

I welcome what the hon. Gentleman said in wishing every success to the current discussions—I am sure that that view is echoed throughout the House. He asks a specific question about discussions that are taking place as he asks the question and I seek to answer it—the matter is currently being debated by the participants round the table. He will be only too well aware that Senator Mitchell asked talks participants not to disclose the contents of his paper, so that it did not become the basis of a media circus rather than the focus of real discussions round the negotiating table. We are at a tense and sensitive time in the process, and I suggest that the hon. Gentleman await the outcome of the negotiations—I am sure that he will welcome any resolution that is arrived at round the table.