HC Deb 15 October 1996 vol 282 cc579-80
10. Mr. Skinner

To ask the Secretary of State for the Environment what is the total number of local authority dwellings at the latest date; and how many were built in the last year. [38359]

Mr. Curry

There were 4.4 million dwellings in the social rented sector at the beginning of April 1995, of which 3.6 million were local authority dwellings. More than 76,000 new social lettings were provided in 1995–6, including 800 in new dwellings built by local authorities. Housing associations are now the main providers of new social housing.

Mr. Skinner

Is the Minister aware that the most savage indictment of this Government over 17 years is that, in 1978–79, when the Labour Government lost office, local authorities built 78 times more houses than the Government are building at this time? Only a paltry 605 were built for the whole of England and Wales during the course of last year. Old-age pensioners are being shunted from hospitals to community care who should be in warden-controlled accommodation.

When the Prime Minister talks about coming from two-roomed accommodation in Brixton to 10 Downing street, what about all the others, those who have only two rooms in which to live; and what about all those who do not have a roof over their head? It is time that the Government released capital receipts to allow Labour local authorities to build dwellings for the people who badly need them.

Mr. Curry

It is the dwellings that were built by so many Labour local authorities that we are now having to put right by programmes such as estate renewal. The trouble with the hon. Gentleman is that he has learnt absolutely nothing. He knows nothing about housing associations. He knows nothing about private sector investment of £10 billion in the social housing sector. He knows nothing about new opportunities for landlords. He knows nothing about new opportunities through housing companies. He wants none of that. He has learnt nothing and he has forgotten nothing. He is the last Bourbon of Bolsover and has views of no future but a failed past.

Mrs. Peacock

Can my right hon. Friend tell the House how much of the presently retained capital receipts would be available for building if all local authorities paid off their debts?

Mr. Curry

My hon. Friend is right. While local authorities maintain debt, they have to pay interest on it and would have to levy council taxes to do so, or they can use the income from their capital receipts to meet those charges. It is entirely mythical that capital receipts are some bonus that has already been paid before. We are talking about public expenditure, and if it were to be spent, other spending would have to replace it or there would have to be borrowing. If the hon. Member for Bolsover really wants to help authorities that are in the worst situation, it would be much more simple to give credit approvals. That is public expenditure as well. There is no way around it.

Mr. Dobson

Will the Minister confirm that just 605 houses were started by local authorities in England last year? As an example, in the north-west there are 14,000 homeless families, but not one house was started by local authorities in the north-west—not one house in Blackpool, Bolton, Bury, Oldham, Rochdale or Manchester. Does he not think that that is a disgrace? Does he not realise that many local authorities have capital receipts? That money should be invested in finding somewhere decent for homeless people.

Mr. Curry

The Labour party is obsessed with capital receipts and is trying to do it with mirrors—[Interruption.] The Labour party has said that it is not prepared to redefine the public sector borrowing requirement. The shadow Treasury team has said that. It may be that, occasionally, Governments get caught by their Treasury when they arrive in office, but it is remarkable to be shackled by the Treasury before being anywhere near office.

This is public expenditure, however it is defined, and it is not a disgrace that local authorities are not building many houses, because we do not intend them to. We think that housing associations do the job better, and if we had not moved the emphasis to housing associations, the social housing market would not have received £10 billion in private sector investment since 1988. That is an outstanding record. It is one that I hope other people will emulate. There is no case for continuing local authority build when one can pull private sector money alongside public sector money, as local authorities do by helping housing associations.