Capital Challenge (Hansard, 26 March 1996)

§ 10. Mr. Livingstone
To ask the Secretary of State for the Environment what recent discussions he has had with local authority associations concerning capital challenge. [209451

§ Mr. Gummer
The Minister for Local Government and Housing met them on Monday 18 March.

§ Mr. Livingstone
Can the Secretary of State confirm that the funds available will be top-sliced from existing capital programmes and that there will be no additional resources? The whole thing is just a con.

§ Mr. Gummer
The fact is that, by having a challenge system, we ensure that those who use the money best and get the best value for money get the money they need. I am pleased to see that the borough of Brent—now under new management, and not the worst borough in London as the hon. Gentleman once called it—is in favour of that system. That is because the council has seen how successful the system is, and that is why the council is so good.

§ Mr. Jacques Arnold
Will my right hon. Friend accept from me that the people of Denton in the borough of Gravesham are delighted with the challenge fund, because they have waited for the improvements in Denton for many years and they have not had any progress out of the Labour-controlled councils' It is only the Government's challenge fund that is turning that project into reality.

§ Mr. Gummer
I am sure that my hon. Friend will have noticed that the Labour party cannot take seriously that which has given a great deal of help to many people in some of the most deprived areas in the United Kingdom. The great advantage of the challenge fund is that councils do not get the money just because they have the need: they get the money just because they can meet the need. The Opposition cannot meet the needs of those who are most in need.

§ Mr. Vaz
When will the Secretary of State realise that the competition that he is proposing in capital challenge is exactly the same in principle as that proposed for the single regeneration budget? He will know about the disastrous bidding process that led to numerous complaints about the way in which that process operated. Is not capital challenge just another cynical attempt by the Government and the Secretary of State to reduce further the ability of local government to make decisions locally, free from his interference and that of his ministerial colleagues?

§ Mr. Gummer
The all-party Select Committee on the Environment praised that system. The local government organisations have seen how successful it is, and it will mean that local government has much more say over what it does. All local government has to do is show that it will use the money properly. The hon. Gentleman is totally out of touch with his own members in the country. If he travelled around and met a few sane Labour members—there are a few—he would realise that what he has said has no connection with what they say.